No more right turns at Greeley: “I don’t want another tragedy”

Thank You!

I\’m glad Sam Adams is an impatient person when it comes to safety.

While I think this is great, I\’m concerned that there don\’t seem to be signs showing a detour. Without a clear detour, cars might still try to turn right, but instead of taking the original route, they will try to take a sharp right turn where the NB left turn lanes enters Greeley. This will be quite a bit more dangerous for everyone, because it will be even more unexpected by everyone around. We\’ve all seen people drive the wrong way down a one way street or turn on a no-turn sign because they were confused, lost, unfamiliar with the area, or trying to follow directions. What is PDOT doing to prevent this sort of thing from happening?

\”What is PDOT doing to prevent this sort of thing from happening?\”

You make a good point Dave. I was at the press conference and after a person in a car stopped to express their displeasure with not being able to turn right I thought they might try and make that turn you describe.

As for PDOT, Sam Adams made it clear in the press conference and in the official press release where cars should go if they want to turn right… that being said, I agree with you that perhaps some detour signage would be good.

The good news is that Adams\’ staffers and lots of folks at PDOT are likely reading these comments so your idea will be heard.

Thanks.

Commissioner Adams,

I want to extend my heartfelt thanks to you for taking swift action after another cyclist was hit today at the intersection of N Greeley and N Interstate Ave. As a resident of North Portland, I bike through this intersection every time I bike to work, as does my husband, and the thought of getting caught by a right-turning motorist on such a steep hill has unsettled us both. There truly is no reason that people can\’t turn right earlier at Going Street if they need to access Swan Island. Thank you for taking action, and I appreciate your efforts to improve bike safety in Portland, as it is an important component of forward-thinking transportation options in this city.

Write Sam and thank him yourself:
commissionersam@ci.portland.or.us

I posted this on another thread on November 1st. I think it bears repeating. Folks at PDOT should look at ways to make it easier for traffic going south on interstate to find their way to their destination without making the right turn. The turn via Larrabee and Russel is one way, there may be others.

From Nov. 1:
A few thoughts on N. Interstate and Greeley:

Provide a bail out route for traffic that needs to turn right but has not seen the signs. This could be at Interstate and Larrabee (right on Larrabee, around the pump station to Russell, left on Interstate, north to Greeley and make a left).

My letter to Sam

Thank you Sam for the quick response prohibiting right turns at Interstate and Greeley. Taking action for the safety of cyclists and pedestrians at the expense of motorist convenience is a revolutionary act in the US. I hope to see more efforts to make the least polluting modes of transport the safest, most comfortable and most enjoyable ways to get around.

No intersection is as \”inherently unsafe\” as a driver who is comfortable in the knowledge that there will be no citation or investigation for failing to yield to a cyclist in the bike lane, though there be a resulting death or serious injury. No intersection is as \”inherently unsafe\” as CDL holding heavy vehicle operators with a mile long record who are allowed to continue driving after killing someone due to negligence. No intersection is as \”inherently unsafe\” as our car-centric culture of transportation that promotes unsafe driving as the epitome of refinement, from DVD screens to cell phone use to flimsy requirements for licensure.

I know you\’re working, Mr. Adams, and I am glad you\’re taking this seriously and acting quickly, but there is much to do before I am satisfied. Thank you for paying attention.

Thank you Sam Adams!

I\’ve been thinking about this pretty hard for the last week or so now. I have very little faith in motorists learning to look for through bike traffic to their right when turning right across a bike lane.

I don\’t really see how the bike boxes are going to solve the problem of improperly positioned bike lanes located to the right of right-turning motorists, they are just a band aid solution to a very serious problem, and not a very good one at that.

However, rather than eliminate all bike specific infrastructure, as has been suggested by some vehicular cyclists, I think the solution is to build better bike infrastructure informed by the cardinal principles of vehicular cycling, which are speed positioning and destination positioning.

How do we do this?

Most bike lanes are already located according to the principle of speed positioning, to the right of motor vehicle traffic. There are some locations, such as the segment of the N. Interstate bike lane where Brett was killed, and SW Jefferson west of 14th, which are faster downhill sections. In these areas bike lanes should be eliminated in favor of shared lane markings or some other treatment.

At intersections with high percentages of right turns across the bike lane, where room is available to do so, such as NW Everett and 16th, a right turn only lane should be provided. This would be possible if the (brand new) curb extension at the SW corner of NW Everett and 16th was eliminated and a few curbside parking spaces were removed. I think the safety of cyclists at high hazard locations like this is more important than saving a few steps for pedestrians crossing the street, or the sanctity of curbside parking.

Considering the safety of human powered travellers over the convenience of motorists–does Sam Adams have a twin who could work for the city of Vancouver?

So, after thinking about this today for a while, I have come up with a possible scenario.

Witnesses say the woman had pulled an erratic turn into the hospital lot at the top of the hill, cutting off cyclists, then proceeded down the hill to pull a quick, thoughtless, right hand turn at Greeley.

Appears to me to be obvious that due to the design of the Max line, and limited and difficult access to the Hospital, she must have missed her turn, then tried to turn it around at the top of the hill.

I imagine she realized she could not do this (as witnesses also said she immediately pulled back out from the lot) continued down the hill, and being very frustrated and possibly late for an appointment (?), made an erratic right hand turn at Greeley, not using her mirrors, or her common sense, taking out another cyclist in the process.

While this in no way, in my mind, absolves her of any fault (as everything so far seems to point to her being at fault, please correct me if I am wrong), it does point to one of the growing problems in this city.

Interstate avenue has been entirely changed for the worse since the Max went in. Bicycle and car access is now a night mare. The added frustration of sometimes waiting through two and three light cycles while trains plow on through (or don\’t) has been experienced by myself on a bike, on foot, and in a car. Along with having to go horrendously out of the way to get anywhere.

Add to this the cyclist who got too close to the train at Greeley and Interstate,(where the train goes very, very fast, much too, coming up, and down the hill) and ended up stuck under it, miraculously alive.

And the recent reality that security at Max stations, or on trains, throughout the city is not at all what it appears. (Tri Met it appears was covering this up, due to recent news reports)

This intersection that has been the recent site of three bicycle accidents (at least three that were reported, probably more than that), was \”Horribly\” redesigned as part of the Interstate Max project.

Along with holding drivers, cyclists, the Police and City Hall responsible for their actions, this same attention should immediately be applied to Tri Met, who all over our city, many, many times a day, violate the rights and right of way of cyclists, pedestrians, and drivers alike.

It is no secret that I have a extreme dislike for Tri Met.

It is time to stand up, and force our supposed \”Public Transportation\” to step up, and stand along side the other accused.

Rant over.

I suppose not everyone will agree with me on this note, but once again, I have been around the block a few times.

Before I vote Sam for Mayor I want to know what he\’s going to do about reforming the Police Bureau if elected.

I\’m pretty sure Jonathan didn\’t ask this to Sam in his interview, and I think we all have a right to know the answer to this question sooner rather than later.

Check the Oregonlive website. A number of motorists think this reaction is unfair to motorists because \”bicyclists caused the last two accidents.\” That can all be traced to Kruger and the PBB comments. I\’m with BURR. I want to know what\’s going to be done to reform the PBB. We\’re trying an engineering only solution to what needs to be addressed by a combination of engineering, enforcement, and education.

John R:

I don\’t know about using the oregonlive forums as a basis for how the general public feels about anything. Those boards consist of the same 10 wackos who seem to be pretty much anti everything. I get the feeling sometimes that that board is trolled so much that the trolls can\’t tell who is who (as luck would have it I know for a fact that at least one of the posters who come up with some of the more asinine comments is actually a bored Intel employee).

That said, reading those forums too often does kind of give you a sick feeling in your stomach because it makes you realize that there are some people out there who really may feel that way (and I am not even talking about bike stuff, just in general regarding that site).

In Response to 31, Crash N. Burns

I can\’t support Jonathan Maus for city council. He is doing what the press gave up years ago, i.e. effective journalism.

I felt the poll was not a correct gauge of the real issue..

The right turn from s-bound Interstate to n-bound Greeley should have been removed when Interstate MAX was built. There is no need for it. Greeley, Interstate and I-5 all feed into Going Street for access to Swan Island. Someone who missed the turn at Interstate & Going can do legal U-turns at several lights along Interstate or use the \”jug-handle\” at Russell.
This turn is really the exception on Interstate where slower speeds and fewer traffic lanes have made it a safer street for all modes. The two busiest intersections, Interstate/Lombard and Interstate/Going, have had fewer crashes since Interstate was rebuilt for MAX, despite lots of bikers, pedestrians, transit riders and in the case of Going Street, trucks. Slower speeds and fewer lanes are key changes to make streets safe for all.

Yep. Ban LEFT turns too. Hey, how \’bout U-turns? Naaaaaaaaaaah.

Article Title – No more right turns: “I don’t want another tragedy”. But we are really talking about right turns at a particular intersection. I think the problem is bigger than this one intersection. You can\’t close off all right turns.

Yes this is a very dangerous intersection. And very sad things have happened at that intersection. It needs to be fixed.

But, please keep in mind that that 1000s of portland cyclist DONT go through that intersection every day. Yet every intersection where a car turns right crossing a bike lane presents the oppurtunity for a failure to yield/hooking for everyone of those cyclist.

I would like to hear a call for some broad enforcement. So I\’m calling for it. Let\’s see some very visible enforcement of motorists who fail to respect right of way rules. Lets see some cops on bikes setting up the sting. Let\’s see some meaningful support from the enforcement community.

If the right turn as engineered was \”inherently dangerous\” why was done in the first place? Did the safety \”guru\” approve it? One thing you can say about ol\’ Sam Adams, he ain\’t camera shy.

Metal Cowboy
November 7th, 2007 00:56
132

I\’m reposting this rant of mine from last night – in light of the follow up that no citations will be issued for Doyles \”bumps and scraps, I have decided to organize a series of protests and education rides, press conferences, cyclist\’s civil rights movement – a concerte sustained movement if you will. Anyone – and this includes BTA, OBRA, PUMP, Shift – who wants to coordinate with me – I\’m at 503 239 6985, 408 595 6025, http://www.metalcowboy.com
OBRA has talk of a press conference for tonight but not sure it is going to happen. I want to plan a larger activism ride, demonstration – (thousands of riders) and press conference for next week.

….This case would be a good one to start a \”citizen\’s initiation of violation proceedings\”.

Let\’s do it!

No citations, no penalties, media all over the place calling her injuries \”not serious\”… meanwhile, she\’s in the hosptial tonight. KINK FM followed police and paramedics and TV and The Oregonian\’s lead, saying Doyle was not badly hurt????? WTF?

It all adds up to the larger Portland Public thinking this is how it works around here – we bump and grind a few cyclists in the name of progress. Look, she\’s fine, cyclist have to stay on the sidelines because if not they\’ll be dead right. i\’m livid, have been for weeks, been doing what I can to letter write call etc. wave my helmet in the air but enough\’s enough – I have three small children, a lot of work and living on my plate, all the blah blah excuses, but I\’m gonna have to dust off my activist cap and wade in… it\’s what tracy, Brett, doyle and the rest of us \”accidents\” waiting to happen deserve…

I\’m done – count me in for whatever protests, sit ins, class actions, letter writing, phone call bombardments to city hall, citation lawsuits. I\’ll give money to a law fund to get this rolling. I\’ll lead a ten thousand cyclist pedal around city hall – I\’m tired of hearing people say to me, \”Yep, you and your cycling friends are following the law in these accidents, but they\’ll just keep being dead right if they don\’t let the cars do their thing… we\’ll, if drivers who kill and injure cyclists have NO consequences – i.e still driving trucks and cars after running someone over, then we get the future we\’re will to put up with!

The Oregonian\’s coverage has been milk toast, lackluster regarding her injuries and kit glove regarding Kruger\’s bias, logic, pr flubs, etc. and I say this with seven years experience as a former newsman at a daily AP paper. We need to force their hand with a massive editorial letter writing campaign. I\’ll send me second letter to the ed. on this issue in the morning. Who is with me?

With everything that has happened, the media is so behind the curve…still running lame channel 8 segments about Cars Vs Bikes – sell the sizzle to make the viewership – focused heavily on bikes running stop signs in Ladds while cars are playing pinball with cyclists in North Portland? Again, WTF?

I\’d throw up my hands dodge and weave the front fenders and take the lane when need be like I learned growing up in Florida, business as usual, except that I really think we have a good community that wants to find some answers – which includes cyclists, drivers, some enlightened politicans etc. – we just need to push harder, we have to make more noise, we have to stand up for our rights and not be worried that it might make us targets… we already are – put some demands out there in force – as a unified, large vocal group to get Kruger off the traffic beat, file suits that sting and make statements, demand a ton more funding for education, enforcement, bike infrastructure…. We need to take this moment to act, thoughtfully but decisively – something along the lines of a civil rights movement for cyclists. I pay taxes and don\’t feel like I need to kowtow or apologize for using my streets to get around on two wheels. I follow every traffic law I can on my bike unless it endangers my future. I will not sit idle while potential riders beg off because they think our streets are too dangerous to take up something that cuts obesity, greenhouse gases, saves money, healthcare costs….

I commend Sam A for his quick actions today in closing the turn – let\’s lobby for a permanent fill in of that turn intersection and then keep the movement going on sppots around the city…

I think the time for a timid response on cycling is done – the cycling community needs to show some real outrage, in mass, beyond blogs ( awesome and very effective tools that they are) a calm, measured, intelligently and eloguently put outrage, but more proactive rather than what feels, at times, reactive – call a press conference of our own with a tousand vcyclists on the waterfont and put the entire community on notice that cyclists are not going to just be mowed over so people can get wherever they need to be 30 seconds faster.

I\’m in the middle of writing a cover story for Bicycling magazine about my family adventure across Canada by bike, so I\’ve taken the opportunity of having editor\’s ears to pitch a feature on Portland\’s growing pains as a sustainable bike friendly beacon -I welcome ideas as I get that story into the pipeline – If the world (NYT\’s etc) is going to keep holding us up as an example of how it can be for cyclists – we have to hold ourselves responsible for making it so – by holding police, planners, fellow cyclists, politicans, engineers, drivers, etc. accountable – it boils down to letting the politicans know with our votes, careless violating drivers through stiff penalities, planners by getting a much bigger portion of tax dollar spent on cycling and most important – by pedaling the streets in numbers every day.

My rant is done by my efforts are not.

Joe Metal Cowboy Kurmaskie

I completely agree with Metal Cowboy @43. This is why I am a bit confused at the decline of Critical Mass. I know that Critical Mass in the past has negative attention but what major changes in society weren\’t first precieved as negative? Without large activism there is no catalyst for change and status quo reigns supreme. We can rant about how our rights aren\’t respected and drivers are not ticketed but until the general public and the newsmedia get our take on the issue there is no voice. Sure Jonathon gets his 10 second blurb on TV (no disrespect intended) but that is hacked at the cutting room floor.

I happened to be riding by the critical mass that occurred son after Bret was killed. Having never seen or participated in the event, I stopped to chat with a few of the folks.

In my mind, I found it really unfortunate that my impression of the group was a negative one. I am a working professional (an engineer), an avid commuter (since I was 14 I might add), a cycle-tourist (pacific coast among others) and a sometimes cyclocross-racer. My impressions of the folks at the critical mass ride were overwhelmingly of distaste; they reminded me of the pan-handling hippies I used to try and avoid during my college days in Humboldt. My conversation with several of them lead me to believe that the group was composed mainly of the \”heart-felt radical\” type. You know the type – those insensitive to reason and unwilling to compromise on any issue.

Like I said – unfortunate. If I had encountered well-meaning and reasonable people with actual real jobs I would have participated. I guess I am tired of progressive politics always getting the rap in popular culture as being full of \’dirty-hippie\’ types.

NO offense to any actual dirty hippies reading this, of course. I just can not relate to you is all…

Metal-cowboy and toddisitic; I would sincerely love to see more activism among a more diverse cross-section of the cycling community. However, as long as the crowd consists mainly of hippies and anarchists, I could not in good-conscious participate as the impression we would give to the public at large is that we cyclists are a radical minority easily ignored. In fact, we are a (growing!) constituency, which includes persons from ALL walks of life. As I am sure you well know…

Hi Hickeymad,

Pls. see my previous post. I think you\’ll find that the outlined ideas match your vision of a more all-encompassing/up-to-date sort of demonstration. I, too, received some negative impressions of Critical Mass when I first moved to Portland five years ago, and opted not to participate, despite being a devout bike commuter and avid cyclist. A couple of people were banging on cars stopped in traffic on a bridge that day, shouting things at drivers. Well, one of those drivers was a (then) pregnant friend, who is also a bike commuter. I was mortified by such actions and their ramifications; such behavior prompts drivers to apply stereotypes toward all bike commuters and cyclists. My above post is designed to prompt thought about a new, more inclusive kind of demonstration. Pls. read the parts about a proposed \’code of conduct\’ and method of reaching diverse set of supporters/participants. Thank you, and thanks for sharing your honest thoughts.

erin g.:

I whole-heartedly agree. A code of conduct would be critical. As would a respectable face on any media interactions. BTA does a great job at this! Is there anything they are doing already (in-terms of stepped-up activism) that folks like ourselves could get involved in?

hickeymad:
Pity you didn\’t spend more time with the group that evening. Your judgement is off-base- I too was there- and I am also a \”working professional\” (a physician and scientist)and having ridden seriously for more than 38 years. The CM group that evening was respectful and somber. And also totally lawful.

I found the ride inspiring, and suggest that civil, lawful, and courteous protest is essential at this time.

Hey Sam,
This is completely off topic, but since we\’re making safety improvements, lets get the road sweepers to do REGULAR sweeps of the bike lanes on major thouroghfares. I ve been having to ride further toward the car traffic lanes lately due to the amount of debris that gets pushed to the side of the road (otherwise known as the bike lane). This along with less daylight puts me in more vulnerable positions. Also lets enfore daily sweeps by construction companies when their projects leave debris in the road!

later

@ DO #45:

Your claim is BS, it\’s just a lame excuse used by lazy cops. They police do accident investigations and issue tickets all the time for crashes they haven\’t personally witnessed, based on statements from participants and witnesses and evidence at the scene.

Let me ask you a rhetorical question – can cops only file murder, arson or burglary charges in cases where a police officer personally witnessed the crime?

Answer – of course not.

@ toddistic #51

the image of CM is only a negative one because the police and the media made it so. It would in most cases have been a non-event, or at best one of those \’keep Portland weird\’ events if the police hadn\’t shown up to conduct their little police riots month after month after month.

While I think this is great, I\’m concerned that there don\’t seem to be signs showing a detour. Without a clear detour, cars might still try to turn right, but instead of taking the original route, they will try to take a sharp right turn where the NB left turn lanes enters Greeley. This will be quite a bit more dangerous for everyone, because it will be even more unexpected by everyone around. We\’ve all seen people drive the wrong way down a one way street or turn on a no-turn sign because they were confused, lost, unfamiliar with the area, or trying to follow directions. What is PDOT doing to prevent this sort of thing from happening?

I think it\’s interesting that no one has mentioned yet that KGW shot footage of this exact motorist response today at the intersection. I saw it on the 5 pm news, and suppose it will air again at 11.

I actually think Critical Mass is a pretty good idea. It\’s evolution back quite a few years ago now, out of a need to demonstrate the extent of and support for means of transportation beyond the limitations of motor vehicles was a very important step in the direction of a less car dependent world that, hopefully, we will continue to move towards.

It\’s really something to see the great numbers of people on bikes that CM can bring together at one time and place. This kind of visibility and presence was effective here in Portland up until the point that it more or less disintegrated into wholesale disregard for anybody on the road not on a bike. To me, it seemed to possibly be a case of, \’we got all these people together, what do we now?\’. Unfortunately, the answer arrived upon to that question wasn\’t very pretty; streets completely choked up for long periods of time, unnecessarily angering others needing to pass along them.

I expect it\’s possible that CM can constructively play a role in helping to bring to light, pressing needs associated with the bike/motor vehicle interface that need urgent attention. A great number of bike riders together can offer irrefutable proof that their mode of transportation has come of age, and must be effectively and safely factored into the overall transportation infrastructure for the greatest benefit of all citizens of Portland.

The Tracy Sparling memorial ride was conducted quite well, and was generally respected by other road users on a greater level than many CM rallies of past. Even this could be probably be improved though. To offer one example, where a street being ridden has two lanes in the same direction, only occupy one with bikes. Allow motor vehicles to pass on the other. (Actually, now that I think about it….I walked part of the route rather than bike….I\’m thinking of the section near Powell\’s…the ride may have occupied only one lane of Burnside there, but I can\’t remember for sure.)