Road rage incident sparks media frenzy, spurs us-them mentality
Posted by Jonathan Maus (Editor) on July 10th, 2008 at 8:17 am
“Cyclist clubs driver with his bike”
“Bike-car clash morphs into melee: Police say a drunken cyclist used his ride to club a motorist as a mob formed”.
These are the front-page, above-the-fold, lead headlines in the Oregonian today that have quickly caused a frenzy in the local media and among many Portlanders since reported by the Oregonian last night.
Here’s the opening line:
“The cultural clash between Portland bicyclists and motorists took a surreal turn Sunday night when a motorist involved in a tiff with a bicycle rider turned out to be a long-time advocate for cycling.”
The situation involved a man in a car, Colin Yates, who was driving in Southeast Portland and then got into an altercation after he chided a guy on a bike, Mike Steven McAtee, for blowing a stop light.
(The story reminds me of when I got flipped off for doing the same thing — except I was on my bike.)
Yates and McAtee reportedly met up a few blocks later, things escalated, and a melee ensued. Since the incident took place on one of Portland’s busiest bikeways, according to the Oregonian story, many other people (the “angry bicyclists” as the Oregonian referred to them) stopped and stood around while things unfolded. McAtee was reportedly very upset and confrontational, perhaps spurred on by the fact that he was allegedly intoxicated.
McAtee was ultimately charged with third-degree assault, criminal mischief, driving under the influence of intoxicants and disorderly conduct.
Officer Robert Pickett (a regular contributor to BikePortland.org) is quoted in the story as saying, “It’s almost kind of quintessentially a Portland thing.” This quote is being misunderstood. I believe Pickett is referring to the fact that even the person driving the car was someone who also regularly rides a bike (which is illustrative of how many people ride in Portland), not that McAtee’s reaction (or the resulting incident) was normal for Portland or somehow indicative of the community in general.
Not surprisingly, based largely on the way the story was reported, comments on the Oregonian’s online story (and letters to the editor will no doubt take a similar tone) are rife with the same anger and venom we have seen many times in the past.
“Portland bicycling community seriously needs to try to reign in these outlaws.”
“Typical stupid bicyclist. They break the law, you call them on it and they flip out. Too bad he didn’t get beat up some more.”
One commenter even posits that I’m purposely keeping quiet on the story:
“Convenient time for the bikeportland.org forums to be “down for maintenance… “We’ll be back soon” (after our extremist sub-culture’s media exposure on this event has passed)”
A bike/car road rage fight would have been enough red meat, but the fact that Yates (the guy in the car) is a self-described “bike advocate for more than 30 years,” and the fact that McAtee was allegedly drinking and seems to have gone ballistic (swinging his bike like a weapon toward Yates), are a story that is simply irresistible to the local media.
This incident is unfortunate on many levels.
First, let’s remember that the Oregonian reporter was not on the scene. The source of her information should be kept in mind as you read the story.
Most troubling to me is the fact that it will be covered so broadly in the local media (so far this morning I’ve already done interviews with KPAM and KINK radio morning shows). Why does this bother me? Is it because I don’t want to face the music that some Portlanders have bad traffic etiquette? No.
One fact is that I am contacted frequently by people on bikes who are the victims of road rage and near-misses. They call or email me after being run off the road or being scared by the intentionally aggressive behavior of someone else on the road. I rarely cover these stories, in part because it is so common, but also because I realize interactions between road users is a part of being in traffic.
It’s similar to how I don’t cover all the bike/car collisions I hear about. They are unfortunate, but they are expected outcomes of sharing the road (and hopefully they’ll happen less as we learn more about multi-modal street designs).
But more importantly, I do not see the world from the view of someone being a “bicyclist” or a “motorist”. Close readers of this site will notice that for several months now I have never used the terms myself.
I feel that the “-ists” are nothing more than labels and that they only lead toward more us vs. them reactions.
I am not a bicyclist or a motorist, I am a person. I hope someday everyone begins to understand that the way we choose to move around the city does not define who we are.
I also look forward to the day when an argument in the street between two people (even if they are both, gasp, “cyclists!”) does not end up all over the news.
[Editor's note: I heard about this incident right after it happened, but I was working on another story and decided not to follow up on it right away.]
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July 10th, 2008 08:22
please try not to blow stop signs.
July 10th, 2008 08:25
Well written, J.
I agree, we are all people; our mode of transportation shouldn't matter. We should treat everyone the same way we want to be treated: with respect.
In the paper-paper (as opposed to the online-paper), this story was front page news: top of the page, above the fold, the first headline you see. This will definitely spur more "bikes vs car", "us vs them" behaviors, and not necessarily positive ones.
July 10th, 2008 08:26
PS: When will the forums come back? I really miss them!
July 10th, 2008 08:29
The bicycle is for escape. Let's build some trails and hit the woods.
July 10th, 2008 08:31
I think it is actually good when a cyclist stands up to a motorist. It lets motorists know that they can't push all of us around, that some of us may fight back. They reason motorists pull most of the sh!t they pull is because they think there won't be repurcussions.
July 10th, 2008 08:33
Who is Colin Yates, anyone know? Seems like our town has a lot more self described cycling advocates than cycling advocates sometimes?
July 10th, 2008 08:35
2% of the population are yahoos. They are cutting people off in cars, or jerks in line at the grocery store, or fighting at a bar. Occasionally they happen to be on bikes.
July 10th, 2008 08:35
Sometimes it's nice to be both, so that you can understand both points of view. I bike a lot. I drive a little. I get both sides of the picture and I do my best to be courteous whatever mode of transport I'm using that day. It saddens me when I see this aggressiveness on either side when we're all just trying to get to work/school/home. It annoys me when I see people, whether in a car or on a bike, blow stop signs and/or lights without even slowing down. It irks me when people, whether in a car or on a bike, feel a sense of entitlement to breaking the law and putting others in danger. The attitude on the roads needs to change. No one is "better" than anyone else on the road. You may choose to only bike, you may choose to drive a Prius. Good for you. But being self-righteous about it doesn't get anyone anywhere. Be respectful. Be courteous. Remember the cliche: you catch more flies with honey than vinager. End of soap box. Thank you.
July 10th, 2008 08:40
Really good point. Bikeportland.org rarely covers any of the car-nearly-hits-bike stories or driver-swerves-and-shouts stories... because "interactions between road users is a part of being in traffic". And also because generally, the cyclist is unable to identify the driver -- who accelerates away.
You rarely cover these. The mainstream media NEVER covers these. Editors don't think stories about car-nearly-hits-biker are sexy.
That said, this story is hurting the bicycle community. If Yates really is a cyclist who was trying to caution a reckless fellow biker (and didn't use his car recklessly to stop the guy), he ought to be getting applause from us. I bike everywhere and cautioned young guys about blowing reds and gotten the same F-you attitude the story says he got.
July 10th, 2008 08:42
I couldn't agree more J. The reality is that I both drive a car and ride a bike. I'm not either/or. A car pushing me off the road pisses me off just like a bike blowing a stop sign in front of me.
It all gets back to people and their behavior, not the type of vehicle they choose to use.
July 10th, 2008 08:43
Hey Skidmark:
That is the most ridiculous thing I have ever read. So, the only reason you personally don't break laws is because of the possible repercussions? Otherwise you would act like an rude, stinkin' idiot all of the time?
J: great point of view in your article. I can only imagine what you had to stew on before writing it.
Personally, I don't think it is advisable for anyone to "police" someone else's actions. You never know who you are dealing with. Its a big world with a lot of freaks.
July 10th, 2008 08:43
SkidMark, there's a massive difference between someone standing up when an injustice is visited upon them and someone acting belligerently when another person has, to all evidence, simply pointed out a wrong. All evidence, including another cyclist's witness statement, points to McAtee attacking, not 'standing up to,' Yates.
Riding a bike does not give one a free pass to violate laws (i.e. stop sign/light laws) and then get indignant when they are confronted about violating those laws. Being a one ton metal box does not give one the right to act like a dickhead either. I, much like Tasha, ride A LOT, walk a lot, and drive very little. I understand the need for people using either mode of transportation to show respect and patience to each other. This respect includes following the rules of the road.
July 10th, 2008 08:44
"That said, this story is hurting the bicycle community."
Ben,
We must stop self-marginalizing ourselves by using labels like "bike community". This incident hurts the Portland community.. it is not about solely the "bike community". the sooner we stop trying to label people and place them in definable groups the better.
in my mind, there is no "bike community"... we simply live in a community where a lot of people ride bikes and a lot of people love them, create things around them, advocate for them, etc.. ... there's a major difference
July 10th, 2008 08:44
This wasn't a confrontation between a "bicyclist" and a "motorist," but rather a drunken hothead and someone who should have saved his critique of the other's actions for a more constructive moment. Yelling at anyone, either from a bike or a car, isn't going to change anybody's mind about anything. Throwing your bike onto someone for yelling at you is just f-ing stupid. (sigh...)
July 10th, 2008 08:47
Colin Yates is, or was since he appears to be moving to Colorado, a mechanic at the downtown Bike Gallery. I think he may have been the lead mechanic there.
He's certainly one hell of a good wrench. Whenever I needed my bike tuned "just so" Colin was the guy to see. I'll really miss seeing him there.
I will also say that in my interactions with him, Colin seemed like a down to earth guy. I'm really sorry that his last interaction with the Portland bike scene was so negative.
Regarding the coverage, I'm glad the Oregonian seems to have ferreted out what actually happened. I'm just sorry the lead of the story didn't say, "Drunk moron accosts fellow cyclist who happened to be driving his car."
-Todd
July 10th, 2008 08:48
Excellent post. I hope the people who are making comments on Oregonlive would read this and see that Mike McAtee does not represent all bikers in the city, but was just some drunk idiot that happened to be riding a bike.
http://blog.oregonlive.com/breakingnews/2008/07/angry_bicyclists_gang_up_on_th.html
Read the comments. Pretty scary.
July 10th, 2008 08:53
it's like every discussion ever had in the comments and forums on this site just happened in one incident... the perfect storm.
July 10th, 2008 08:56
Great post Jonathan. It is sad that it's making such big headlines since as you pointed out, road rage against people on bicycles happens with greater frequency. I guess it's a classic case of man bites dog.
July 10th, 2008 09:00
This drunken idiot should be made to publicly apologize for his actions. There are a lot of people doing a lot of hard work for the bicycle community. And as cyclists we need to chastise these people who undermine the efforts of people working hard for us. We are all in this together.
July 10th, 2008 09:03
Just as Jill's said, there's yahoo's everywhere. (although I'd venture to guess it's more than 2% ;)) Just so happens this time it's someone who decides using a bike as a melee weapon would be the way to go.
Just like the guy who nearly runs me off the road while he's making a right turn into traffic, decides *I* am to blame and flips me off.
July 10th, 2008 09:04
Thanks for posting this, Jonathan. Granted, this is indeed a bit of an asshole vs. asshole rather than bike vs. car thing.
My wife and I came up with an analogy for what Mr. Yates was doing though (Mr. McAtee's response was wholly inappropriate, of course): Driving in a car and chastising a cyclist for his riding behavior is very much like waving a loaded gun and telling someone to watch out where he's swinging a very small stick.
July 10th, 2008 09:06
Hot time, summer in the city, back of my neck getting awful gritty.
Jonathan's point about shifting our speak and mindset away from a bike community to a city where one of our major ways of getting around is by bike, this is key - I'm getting a guest column together about how this is why cities in Italy felt so biek friendly even though they did not have major bike infrastructure, or could have used more. It's the attitudes of people, in cars, on bikes andd on foot that make the difference, that said, stupidity is a resource that, unlike oil, will never run out, so in any situation you find yourself in on the streets, outbursts and hand gestures and blowing lights, whatever you are using to get around, this helps no one.
July 10th, 2008 09:07
"Driving in a car and chastising a cyclist for his riding behavior is very much like waving a loaded gun and telling someone to watch out where he’s swinging a very small stick."
that's a very important point Jason. I agree. Many of the vitriolic commenters, bike haters, and members of the local media who don't regularly ride a bike, don't understand the psychological stuff going on in situations like this.
July 10th, 2008 09:08
According to the Oregonian, the guy's name is Steven McAtee. Jonathan... your article says his name was Mike McAtee..... Which is correct?
July 10th, 2008 09:09
It's hard not to blow stop sign. you guys know what I mean...
July 10th, 2008 09:11
STEVEN McAtree is an idiot, to be sure. No excuse for his actions. But Yates should have kept his thoughts to himself. Confronting people on the street is risky (obviously). And did he really believe that this guy was going to modify his behavior? Come on.
What always surprises me is the vitriol of the motorists comments. What is it about drivers that makes them so upset when they see bikers break the law? How does it affect them in any way?
July 10th, 2008 09:12
While the actions of McAtee can be written off as those of a drunken hothead, the more telling part of the article is how a mob of fellow cyclists formed around the scene as McAtee accosted the driver. This group behavior speaks to the us v. them angle that is so appealing for the media to pick up on, and which makes it such a hot button issue for motorists.
"About 25 to 30 people were gathered, and police described the atmosphere as hostile towards the motorist. Some witnesses were afraid to speak up for Yates."
July 10th, 2008 09:14
JH - What?? We don't live in a dictatorship. Do you think further dividing people is going to help?
July 10th, 2008 09:15
+1 for Colin. He was the manager of Beaverton Bike Gallery a few years back before moving to another store. I can't imagine him doing anything more than telling the cyclist he ran the red and it doesn't help the general perception of cyclists any.
July 10th, 2008 09:17
"the more telling part of the article is how a mob of fellow cyclists formed around the scene as McAtee accosted the driver."
prtlndntv... remember that this is a very popular bike boulevard street with a lot of bike traffic... and there was likely confusion at the scene as to what happened.
also remember that the Portland Police were quick to characterize a spontaneous dancing episode on Alberta Street during Last Thursday as a "riot"... so don't believe everything you read in the paper.
July 10th, 2008 09:25
"Driving in a car and chastising a cyclist for his riding behavior is very much like waving a loaded gun and telling someone to watch out where he’s swinging a very small stick."
I fully disagree with this statement. And it does not seem to apply to the situation.
Someone who see's someone else acting like an idiot should speak up. This sounds dorky but.. Traffic is a community, all particpants need to speak up and 'chastize' the IDIOTS what ever they may be riding/driving. That is how community/cooperative environments work.
Enforcement can't do everything.
Education does next to nothing.
If you behave like an idiot on the road and all you neighbors tell you so, and the fellow road users tell you your an idiot. You are probally going to be stop being an idiot.
I applaud Yates for being speaking out.
I hope McAtee gets jail time.
I will continue to speak out against idiots when ever I encounter them. Be they on bikes or driving Hummers.
July 10th, 2008 09:26
This is just great. The Oregonian leads with "Cyclist clubs driver with his bike", in huge type; below this is "Iran tests missiles in range of Israel". Makes me wonder if Rupert Murdock bought the Oregonian. I'm already getting the comments from coworkers, like "I think it's great that more people are riding bikes, but a lot of them are rude jerks." Or "I know you're not like that, but I think your the minority." This is an unfortunate road rage incident, and I'm glas Jonathan characterized it that way. One traveler attacked another on the road, regardless of bike vs. car. And SkidMark, this guy was not standing up to a motorist, he violently attacked someone who verbally chastised him. I'll only point out bad cycling behavior if someone actually does me some perceived harm, like running a stop sign when I have the right of way, or passing too close without warning. I also bike and drive; whichever I choose on a given day does not categorize me. What really gets me is The Oregonian devoting nearly the entire top half of their front page to this dog bites man story.
July 10th, 2008 09:27
perhaps people should mind there own business more often. if you dont want to run red lights, then dont. if your not a cop, keep your opinions to yourself. otherwise you come off as a self richeous asshole.
July 10th, 2008 09:33
It's unfortunate that 1) we all get put into categories and groups (race, religion, transportation, take your pick) 2) those categories and groups always contain belligerent, angry, self-centered people and 3) people are really eager to find those belligerent, angry, self-centered people acting out in society and then say "see, those people are all angry and belligerent and don't care about anyone else!" I think it's unfortunate whenever that happens, no matter which group of people it is that is getting unfairly labeled.
July 10th, 2008 09:34
There are a lot of latent death-threats in the Oregonians comments section, which is scary. I like you distinction that we are all people, Mr. Maus. It's good to keep in mind.
July 10th, 2008 09:39
Thanks a lot McAtee. What a jerk. The reaction of the crowd which according to the story really formed after said jerk had just gotten a little of what was owed to him speaks to the ever present feeling of threat most frequent cyclists feel from some motorists. I'm sure most of use have been intimidated by someone in a car, it happens all day every day. So if you come on a scene of a conflict of this nature it would be easy to make errant assumptions. That is the problem with stereo types and assumptions, they are just as likely to be wrong as not.
July 10th, 2008 09:39
Very thoughtful commentary, Jonathan, and thanks for clarifying the intent of my "quintessential" comment--that people who ride bikes and people who drive cars are often the same people, particularly in Portland.
I also kept saying that we are all traffic, and that we are all simply trying to get to where we are going via different modes of transportation, but that stuff didn't make it into the article.
July 10th, 2008 09:41
Jonathan,
I want to give you props on the language points your making. I love the "bike Community" as much as I love the "Visual Arts Community" as well as some others. I be involved as much as I can but sometimes feel bit looked down on because of a perceived lack dedication to "the group".
It's terrible this happened, but I'm happy to see we are having a respectful dialog about some really important stuff.
July 10th, 2008 09:44
I am mildly amused by the incident. It really illustrates just how much our behavior on the road impacts others. On foot, two wheels or four, the golden rule is the only rule.
July 10th, 2008 09:44
I encourage all of you to write the Oregonian to complain about their trashy, sensationalist approach:
maxinebernstein@news.oregonian.com
srowe@news.oregonian.com
michaelwalden@news.oregonian.com
July 10th, 2008 09:44
I love that a road rage between someone on a bike and in a car in Portland is front page news. When in other cities if a road rage incident happened and someone was shot and possibly killed, itd be lucky to see page 4.
Its amazing how this town gets so worked up over the details of what makes a functional society.
July 10th, 2008 09:45
Jonathan,
Much of your coverage on a site that has become the de facto voice of cycling in this city does give credence to the notions of "bike community", "bike culture", and all manner of "bikey" labeling. In fact, many posters on this site revel in those labels.
While I am not suggesting that this become a sanitized and PC site but when new riders and non-cyclists hear about BikePortland.org and visit what do they see? Lots of fringe culture, weirdos, n'er do well "activists", run-ins with police, etc. (Pedalpalooza coverage for example) If they look at the posts, they read loads of anger and anti-everything-but-bikes sentiment. My question is, are we putting our best face forward? Or are we reinforcing the negative stereotypes put forth in the old media? In many ways, the attitudes expressed here are as frightening as those posted at OregonLive.
We as cyclists really need to clean up our act. Car drivers are the majority and feel a sense of entitlement and righteousness. That's a fact. We should rightfully hold them to account for stupid and dangerous behavior while also displaying zero tolerance for our own kind that engage in similar acts. We should stop publically celebrating outlaw events like the Zoobomb, Critical Mass, Naked Ride, etc. if their acts engender ill will towards the greater number of people that happen to utilize bikes. How pissed would the bike community be if someone organized an outlaw "Drive Your Cars on the Springwater Day" or an evening series of "No Headlights on Bike Boulevard Drives"? Yet, we do similar things under the guise of "bike fun" and "protest" and tell non-cyclists to get bent when they object.
We have reached a very critical juncture in Portland. High oil prices, environmental awareness, and traffic gridlock are putting more people on bikes and disrupting the comfortable lifestyle that most commuters have taken for granted. We are mixing on the roads in ever increasing numbers. How do we want this to evolve? As a peaceful coexistence with motorists based on predictable behavior and mutual respect? Or as an "Us vs. Them" pitched battle with many real casualties? I believe that we are headed down the path of confrontation largely because Portland's bike community lacks the maturity and common sense to affect compromise and take the long view. In my opinion, BikePortland should focus on those truly rallying for positive change and stop glorifying / enabling the aspects of our community that most Portlander's see as the "bike problem".
July 10th, 2008 09:47
I commute to work by bike, but drive for longer trips. And I am all for people speaking out when they see something sketchy happen, we wouldn't need the cops so much if we all looked out for each other. But this is a little scary sounding, a mob of people acting aggressively towards a guy simply because he was in a car. We need a new attitude than the flip off in your face one we have adopted for dealing with crazy people in cars.
July 10th, 2008 09:49
Jonathan's position is right on. I'm not surprised at how fast the the extreme reactions float to the surface, but I'm also relieved to see how most of us choose to be civilized, however difficult it may be sometimes.
July 10th, 2008 09:50
Aka (#25) McAtee didn't run a stop sign, he ran a stop light. IMHO there's a big difference.
July 10th, 2008 09:52
SkidMark: "I think it is actually good when a cyclist stands up to a motorist. It lets motorists know that they can't push all of us around, that some of us may fight back. They reason motorists pull most of the sh!t they pull is because they think there won't be repurcussions."
Exactly. As I rode to work this morning it dawned on me that I'd probably think twice now about yelling at a motorist for doing something stupid and potentially life-threatening for fear of repercussion spurned by this very story. That's so very, very wrong! Cyclists and pedestrians need to make their presence known and respected, and some loud words are just the tip of the iceberg-- sometimes it feels like a struggle to simply not be killed, much less feel like an equal user of our public roadways.
July 10th, 2008 09:56
Leat: "But this is a little scary sounding, a mob of people acting aggressively towards a guy simply because he was in a car."
If I saw two people fighting in the street after an accident-- car vs. bike or car vs. car or bike vs. bike-- I'd probably stop to intervene, call the cops and take video with my cell phone. It's what any responsible citizen would do these days, not the action of a "mob".
July 10th, 2008 10:03
two guys get in to a fight, it happens all the time, rarely is it on the cover of the paper. people fight , we cannot stop that, we need to stop labling it as some kind of culture war
July 10th, 2008 10:03
The headline for this story is so large, I could read it from the street as I rode by a paper box. Please write the Oregonian and ask them to stop this kind of sensational coverage.
July 10th, 2008 10:05
bean, I wasn't talking about myself. I make my choices on the street based on my own safety and the safety of others. I do put me first, as a matter of self-preservation, because those those big tin boxes on wheels can kill you.
Russell, plenty of motorists get indignant when you point out that the moving violation they just made almost killed you. Some of them even get violent. Is that OK? I just think it is about time that the shoe is on the other foot. I don't agree with what he did, it was way over the line and uncalled for, but at the same time, I think it is important for motorists to know that they can't bully cyclists, that we are not all wimpy little peaceniks, and they they may not be as safe as they think they are in their tin box.
July 10th, 2008 10:07
This is exactly the problem I have with alot of bicyclists in this town. They feel entitled and that they deserve something because they are riding a bike. But in fact, most of them are aggressive, do not obey traffic laws and ride drunk more than we would like to think. I hope the idiot McAtee loses his job with city.
July 10th, 2008 10:09
This reminds me of the media and how they deal with the issue of wolves. More livestock dies each year from eating poison weeds than anything. Way farther down the list, coyotes and dogs are responsible for some deaths. Wolves make up less than one percent of livestock deaths , yet if one wolf kills any livestock, it is always front page news.
It is sad the media choses to put this front page, screaming it out.
It is also sad to see bicyclists using their bikes as weapons. During the naked ride, towards the end of it at Thurman and 23rd, there were 3 guys corking Thurman. A car was slowly, stupidly, sneaking behind them, and I saw one guy pick up his bike and slam it on the car...maybe it is the same guy as this a-hole.
The naked ride was amazing, but I saw 2 separate incidents of aggressive a-hole cyclists, both men.
I did witness a woman driver aggressively trying to harass a male cyclist on my street the other day.I do not know what led to it, but it was insane watching this car trying to run down the rider.
please people, do not escalate to craziness!
July 10th, 2008 10:09
"What always surprises me is the vitriol of the motorists comments. What is it about drivers that makes them so upset when they see bikers break the law? How does it affect them in any way?"
I commute by car and bike when I can. I get upset at any type of motorist when they break the law. The laws are there to keep us safe. But the difference between cars and bikes is a big one, i.e. a couple of thousand pounds.
I don't want to be the one who has to live with the burden of killing or seriously injuring someone because they broke the law. And the simple fact is, if I hit a bicycle it's going to do a lot more damage to the driver than if I hit another car.
If someone on a bike chooses to run a red light (which in my opinion happens much more frequently by people on bikes vs. people driving cars) and I hit them in my car they are likely not going to walk away. When a car and a bike collide, the car always wins.
I too have been flipped of by someone on a bike when I, in my car, let them know they ran a red. Flip me off all you want. If it makes them think twice next time, good.
Several years ago in Eugene I did hit a bicycle. Thankfully, it was a very minor collision at a residential intersection and no one was hurt. But the person on the bike was riding at night without a light, wearing black pants and a hoodie, and going the wrong way on a one way street. Had he been riding properly, i.e. using a light and not been traveling the wrong way on a one way street, the incident probably never would have happened.
July 10th, 2008 10:10
SmartPatrol --
You ask, "What is it about drivers that makes them so upset when they see bikers break the law? How does it affect them in any way?"
I think it violates their sense of justice and "fairness" (I know, life's not fair). It is comparable to the outrage one feels when somebody else "takes cuts" in line, gets away with cheating on an exam, or shoplifts without getting caught. The thoughts we have in these example situations are, "Why do I have to wait in line while that dude takes cuts?", "Why did I knock myself out studying while she just copied the test answers from somebody else?", and, "Why am I paying my hard-earned cash for things that guy is getting for free by stealing?"
I think most of us would feel like the situations in my examples are "not fair" and there should be some type of consequence for the rule-breakers. If I still get into my movie on time and find a good seat, then the line-cutter didn't really affect me--but I'm still outraged. If I still pass my exam without cheating, then the cheater didn't really affect me--but I'm still miffed. If I can afford to buy the things I want or need, then the shoplifter didn't really affect me (except that the price I pay is probably inflated to account for some amount of theft loss)--but I'm still disgusted.
I also think there is the underlying fear that one day, someone's disregard for the traffic laws WILL affect me because they will run into me or vice versa, thereby thrusting me into a potentially tragic, life-altering situation.
July 10th, 2008 10:12
Bully cyclists? I ride and drive, and if a cyclist pasts me on the LEFT and runs a stop light, you bet I'm gonna lean out the window and give him a piece of my mind. That cyclist put himself and possibly the driver of any other vehicle at risk. He deserves any flack he's gonna get from this, he's a numbnut.
July 10th, 2008 10:12
Red lights and stop signs are there to ensure the safe flow of "traffic". So to say that when cyclists blow through them, it doesn't affect me, or because I'm not a cop, I should mind my own business, is ridiculous. It's simply a safety issue.
July 10th, 2008 10:16
Incidents like these are a double edge sword for cycling advocacy...working hard to bring cycling and bike commuting to the forefront of people's thinking and daily existence....which HAS been positively covered by the media...then having to defend itself when one a-hole brings negative coverage...
having the spotlight on you can either be good...or it can be very very bad...just means everyone is watchin'.
July 10th, 2008 10:16
maxadders, did you actually read the article? It was not a group of people respectfully documenting the event with their phones. It scared people. My point is this, I am actually the type to track down crazies in cars and ask them to step out and deal with me (they never do). The other day I saw this huge guy on a bicycle with bike tatoos all over his bod. When he got cut off by someone in a car, he road up along side him, raised his fist, pumped it in the air, and yelled something to the effect of "HEY, you must be in a really big hurry! But watch out for me!", with a big smile on his face. I think the effect was better.
July 10th, 2008 10:16
Going off topic a little, Maxine Bernstein is a horrible reporter. She constantly skews the facts in favor of causing a storm. Whenever I see an article she has written, I treat it like I'm reading an article out of US Magazine.
Props to JM for recognizing that and helping us understanding what truly happened, without all the emotion.
July 10th, 2008 10:21
I think bobcat and Shooter Lazlo and SmartPatrol make a good point about it being a behaviorial problem more than a Bicycle/Vehicle problem.
Now I wasn't there, but having seen similar altercations between individuals (not "cyclists" or "motorists" as Mr. Maus has correctly pointed out) it sounds like two people, to varying degrees, each thought the other was a jerk, had to have the last word, and were each willing to ratchet it up to no end, just to show how "right" they are. Again, not saying that's what these two did specifically, but it brings up the whole point of when it's appropriate to vent, and when it isn't.
I was a little surprised that Mr. Yates , according to the story, called out a stranger on some behavior with his family in the car. I mean, you never can tell what a stranger will do, so why take a chance with your family in tow? That sounded a little reckless. Save the righteousness for when family members aren't caught in the crossfire.
And boy that McAtee doesn't sound like he's a nice guy after a few drinks. Hard day at the planning office? Since it's a city job he'll have no problem keeping his position.
Let's save the testostorone for something meaningful...
July 10th, 2008 10:22
Coin Yates wasn't bullying anybody, SkidMark.
July 10th, 2008 10:23
Steven McAtee, the guy on the bike was reportedly drunk...d-r-u-n-k. I feel that cancels any reasonable excuse he might come up with for his behavior before or after he met up with the driver of the car, Colin Yates.
As usual to really know the why of all that took place in incidents, you probably would have had to be there.
Is it reasonable to assume that Colin Yates, self described bicycle advocate, driver of a car, and also a person people seem to consider as having a mellow disposition, routinely and/or antagonistically calls out strangers on bikes for traffic violations he sees them commit? Or, as in this incident, did he see a drunk, obviously out of control on a bike, either ignoring or failing to notice traffic controls?
Colin Yates actions seem reasonable to me. Are some of you seriously thinking that in a situation like this, everyone should keep their mouth shut, and let irresponsible, out of control idiots like Steven McAtee ride on until they hit someone, or cause an accident? If the drunk person were driving a car, a more likely approach might be to get a license number and call the cops, but since bikes don't have license numbers.... .
July 10th, 2008 10:24
What really surprised me is that if the driver was in fact a "cycling advocate" why the hell did he honk first. There is nothing that pisses me off more than being honked at while riding. Other than that, I think this whole thing has little to do with driving and riding and more to do with two people having a confrontation.
July 10th, 2008 10:26
Too bad Yates didn't pummel the drunkin' tard.
July 10th, 2008 10:27
While there is no excuse for the drunk idiot beating the car/driver with his bike, (and I hope he is made an example of), there is also no reason for the driver to chastise the cyclist for his actions, no matter how wrong they may be.
They both made very bad decisions, which were complicated by public intoxication, and more bad decision making.
July 10th, 2008 10:35
There is no justification for violence here.
But the story once again shows the futility of road users trying to educate other road users whilst on the road.
The offending behavior won't be corrected and the confrontations often get out of hand.
July 10th, 2008 10:37
I agree with you on many levels, and find some of the readers responses to the article to be frightening! I mostly ride a bicycle, and occasionally drive a car. I've also been known to walk, take a bus, a train, a few times ride in a plane. It's so silly to define ones-self by their means of transportation. I love my bicycle, it makes me feel great! I'm saving money and getting exersize, plus Portland is so bike friendly. I see it as my main means of transportaion, it is how I choose to get around. I used to live in the Bay Area (CA) and Los Angeles, where I did NOT have a car, and let me tell you, people were not so bike friendly there (LA mostly).
The problem I have is this, people who think that "messing" with cyclists is okay, or funny, or good on any level, and cyclists who take an aggressive approach to people in cars. I know I've been guilty of the aggressive behavior myself in the past, and it never worked out well for me. I just usually got really angry, and put myself in potentially dangerous situations.
Here's what's up, bicycles have to obey the same rules as cars, so running red lights, not the best idea. Here's what's also up, a person in a car is safe, and surrounded by TONS of metal between them and the cement. A person on a bike has them, their clothes and a helmet. When you drive up really close, because that cyclist just isn't going fast enough for you (duh, they're on a bike, you're in a car) you're putting their life in danger.
Let's all play nice, so far in the 9 months I've been here people seem pretty chill, though I was witness to the death of Tracey Sparling just 2 weeks after I arrived here. A horrible accident.
Point is, we cannot lump everyone into a category. This guy, if he was drunk and wielding his bike, that's him, that's not me. And this other guy, if he's all pro-bicycles, great. That's awesome, maybe he should ride his bike more often, I don't know. It just all seems a little silly to me to point fingers and get super up in arms. They're just a couple of dudes, being dudes.
July 10th, 2008 10:38
I have to disagree with your shunning of 'ists' terms and the 'community' references, Jonathan. Even the 'about' section of this blog refers to us as a bike community.
I see your point that on some level it can create a divide where one need not exist, but the fact remains that cyclists in Portland have been brought together as a pretty cohesive group when you step back and look at the big picture. The BTA, PBAC, and countless other groups support bicycling, sponsor bicycling events, safety lessons, etc. Without such a 'community' we might not have come so far with recent safety measures (bike boxes) and other improvements.
We are a group, and if we're a smart and responsible group (as in, don't attack a driver), then we can be a community without being divisive.
July 10th, 2008 10:38
Chastising a reckless jerk is in the same league as assault and battery, Icarus?
July 10th, 2008 10:39
re: bullying.
I was speaking in broad terms, not just of this specific situation, which I said was "uncalled for and way over the line".
The fact of the matter is that every day motorists push us out of the way, yell sh!t at us, don't "see" us, and generally treat us like we have no right to the road. Not every motorist, but enough to make it dangerous for us.
July 10th, 2008 10:41
While on my commute every morning, I witess many, if not most cyclists running the red lights and to make it worse, there are usually many cars there to witness. I would love to speak out more often, but I'd hate to have some A-hole throw their bike into my skull. Bikers and drivers should have to pass an IQ test.
frustrated but still riding, Brian
July 10th, 2008 10:42
If I'm riding and a motorist drives in a way that puts me at increased risk, I feel that I have a right to respectfully talk to that driver to let them know why a particular action wasn't a good or safe decision.
Similarly, if I encounter a cyclist that behaves in a way that either significantly increases their personal risk or more importantly makes other road users less likely to respect my rights and space as a cyclist, then I feel that I have a right to respectfully talk to them about their behavior.
Obviously, as in this case, there are some idiots in the world who will respond negatively, but I'd rather think that people acted out of ignorance than malice and that we can talk about better choices as rational human beings.
July 10th, 2008 10:44
I checked here because I wanted to know if Yates was a real bike activist or if he just said that. Interesting the O couldn't add that he's a bike mechanic for real.
When I drive it's clear to me that I can yell out the window in response to poor bike riding manners if I really really want to, but it's intimidating to honk at a bike - and the correct response is a loogie.
July 10th, 2008 10:46
I will personally vouch for Mr. Colin Yates. He's a genuine good guy and it's totally bullsh-t this happened on his last day in Little Beirut. Colin is way more than a "cycling advocate". He's a bike person. Ironically this happened within slingshot distance of his old house. This fool McAtee needs to be toe-strapped to the median of I-5 at rush hour.
SmartPatrol wrote, "But Yates should have kept his thoughts to himself." What the f!!! Who's patrol are you workin' for? Cheney's ?????
Damn the Whoregonian. They top-fold a story about a liquered(?) jack-ass, whilst Iran is playing into the hands of this rogue administration selected by the most conservative Supreme Court in decades. Christ on a stick!!!!
The "mob" that formed sorta freaks me out. Were they all a buncha drunk hipsters on their Pistas? Double thumbs up to the puncher of the drunk clown.
July 10th, 2008 10:46
This seems like a drunk driving issue before it's a bike vs. car issue... as hard as the bike v car stuff is to avoid as a topic of discussion.
The comments on the Oregonlive site are completely idiotic and not worth anything at all other than evidence that some people really need to address their sense of perspective.. I guess all the bike haters got tired of story after story after story of bicyclists being harrassed, assaulted, threatened, and killed by careless, and reckless car owners... and thought they'd take the opportunity to jump on a story where that scenario was finally reversed.
I'm absolutely positive that when the next story comes along about a road rage filled car owner chasing down a bicylist, getting out and assaulting him, we'll see the same outrage from the idiots that respond to stories on Oregonlive.
July 10th, 2008 10:50
What are stop lights?
July 10th, 2008 10:53
I think the city should put McAtee on administrative leave. He works for the city (didn't PDX just win an award or something-plutonium level?) and is a PUBLIC SERVANT. The caveman mentality of the group that gathered sickens me too. PDX is great, but we have our fair share of idiots. Regardless, this doesn't help progress on any level. Will the BTA say anything?
July 10th, 2008 10:59
“Typical stupid bicyclist. They break the law, you call them on it and they flip out..." Painfully true.
July 10th, 2008 11:00
What an immense disappointment it is to read the divisive, dividing manner in which The Oregonian chose to cover this news. So many outlets and other Oregonian reporters have taken great strides in revising their approach to covering traffic news, veering away from the “bikes†vs. “cars†mentality toward a more balanced, productive style of reporting (Dylan Rivera of The Oregonian strongly supported the Toward Carfree Cities Conference and Sunday Parkways).
Today’s sensationalist front-page piece is a big step backwards: it generates new levels of road animosity – which is a life threatening issue - while reinforcing stereotypes and community divides. It is one of the most angering and disappointing pieces of reporting that I have seen this year. It is unacceptable. We can take action to prevent further cases of such irresponsible news coverage.
We are ALL Traffic is a citizen coalition that works to improve safety and equality for all who share the road. Our next meeting is on Monday, July 14th at 5:30 p.m. One of our ongoing objectives is to influence the way in which the media covers news. After last November’s rally, which occurred in the wake of two terrible road fatalities, we made many friends in the media, who generously supported our unifying demand for safety and respect on the streets. Today’s Oregonian article is a reminder of how much more work is yet to be done. The media’s influence on the masses is immeasurable. Reporters have a choice when they approach news: they can either perpetuate conflict and community fracturing or use this sort of story as an opportunity to debunk stereotypes and deescalate road conflict and violence. In my opinion, reporters who choose to stir hatred between “cyclists†and “motorists†have blood on their hands when new levels of conflict or “accidents†occur due to lack of respect among those on the road. Conversely, those who report responsibly and ethically should be applauded for the peace-forging work that they do.
If anyone is interested in joining We are ALL Traffic, please contact us right away. We are working hard on safety issues, education, level enforcement, and how the media covers community news. Your level of involvement and time commitment is all up to you; your ideas and good energy are needed! Pedestrians, cyclists, motorists, skateboarders, truck drivers, all of the above- *anyone* who cares about safe access to our public right-of-ways, please join us and get involved: e r i n g r e e s o n @ g m a i l . c o m
Erin Greeson
We are ALL Traffic
July 10th, 2008 11:01
This is a horrible incident, incited by an angry guy who was very disturbed and drunk. There is no excuse for him.
We've all seen people do things that range from careless to absolutely horrible. From the guy who drove full speed through a farmer's market in California (killing 10), to the guy who rode full speed through a stop sign next to a school, to the pedestrians walking down residential streets wearing black.
As someone who's traveled by all means and been involved in transportation for a decade, I see this in it's larger context. People are getting very frustrated with the inequality that everyone is dealing with both on the road and in the economy. Anger is being vented in random ways at people who may or may not be responsible for the problem.
When I see a cyclist or pedestrian doing something horrible, I tend to think to myself, "what would be the possible outcome if this person had been driving?"
Having witnessed drivers (in New York city) intentionally chase down people, I have definitely seen the worse that road-rage can offer. However this particular person has definitely come as close as anyone on a bike has ever come to being as socially destructive as a car.
I think that anyone who meets McAtee must make it clear that he did A LOT of damage.
July 10th, 2008 11:02
I think McAtee was 100% in the wrong, straight down the line, and I second the double thumbs up to the guy who decked him.
But I really don't see what any of this has to do with his job performance. He should be prosecuted for DUI and assault & battery, but leave his job out of it. It's not relevant.
July 10th, 2008 11:04
I'm relatively new to Portland. The bicycle-friendliness of the city was a major pull for me. But dealing with some of the cyclists here is seriously off-putting.
It seems like the cyclist culture is neatly split between the cyborgs and the casuals. I'm a casual. I bike to work, to the movie store, I go on aimless rides after dinner. I ride every day, but I'm not locking my feet onto the crank arms.
Somehow I have near-collisions with cyclists nearly every day. It's usually because they don't obey traffic laws and I do.
Part of me sees cyclists as super-pedestrians, like amphibious beings that can act as car (occupying a lane in the street) or as pedestrian (riding on the sidewalk, not always waiting for the light to change when there's no traffic, etc), as they please. That's a major privilege.
But cyclists need to adapt their behavior for what's appropriate. That is, when in the street, know your rights and claim your space, but also know the laws. Don't run red lights.
I haven't owned a car in years. I'm not an elitist. And I like cycling as much as any of you. But if cycling in Portland wants to approach a level like Amsterdam's, then cyclists need to play fairly.
July 10th, 2008 11:07
KATU ain't looking so bad to me as of this morning.
What a piece of crap writing. When I saw it floated on OL last night I told my wife "Don't worry, an editor will clean this up. It won't make print."
Time to tell those few advertisers the print medium have left that devisive commentary disguised as news will only result in lower return for their media buying dollars.
"out of nowhere"
Give me a break.
July 10th, 2008 11:08
Interestingly enough, the lead headline for the Oregonian online today is about "tension" between bicyclists and "regular" riders on the Max. Now I'm beginning to wonder if the Oregonian has an agenda here, is just being irresponsible. Either way, they are stirring the pot with their sensationalist "journalism".
I too have had comments made to me by coworkers about Portland's bike culture and those "damn bike hippies" lol. For the record, I am conservative looking and in my forties, so they feel comforatble talking to me, so I get to hear all the misconceptions about the so called "bicycle counterculture". As several others have pointed out, bicycles need to be viewed as a viable form of transportation, not a fashion accessory or a lifestyle statement. We could learn a great deal from European cities in this respect. Portland is certainly ahead of the curve for the US on transportation issues, but incidents and news coverage like this one show that there is still a lot of work to be done.
July 10th, 2008 11:08
I've been thinking about this a lot because I have two friends that got into fairly serious bike-on-bike accidents last month. We have all noticed that there are tons more bikes out on the roads this year, and a lot of new bikers doing some pretty stupid, unpredictable and dangerous things. This incident shows that calling them out might not be the best way to go. Really we need to teach folks how to be good riders through our actions. Follow the laws, signal your turns. With half the city riding we are no longer renegades and need to stop acting that way.
July 10th, 2008 11:13
This "bikes versus cars" debate is silly.
Around 80% of Portland bicyclists also own and drive a car, which makes the argument redundant before you've even begun.
Plus, the actions of one person should never be perceived as the actions of an entire demographic.
Cars run red lights ALL THE TIME. Go out to 82nd Ave and look. That doesn't mean that ALL car drivers are evil.
Same with bikes. Bicyclists who blow stop signs are stupid, yes.
But I would argue that they are not so much "bad bicyclists" as much as stupid, inconsiderate human beings.
Rant over!
July 10th, 2008 11:14
Well, as for KATU, their lead story on their website this morning was regarding "tension" on the Max between bicyclists and "regular" riders. Way to stir the pot KATU. Even in bike friendly Portland bicycle advocacy is an uphill battle.
July 10th, 2008 11:17
The most thought provoking post on here is Brad's #42, yet it has been totally ignored in the squelch of bicycle righteousness. I get the feeling that instead of being part of the solution, many folks here want to be part of the revolution. The topic of conversation should be about personal responsibility and obeying basic traffic rules that are implemeted for ease of flow and safety. There really is no other issue. A number of bicyclists in this town, old and young ignore these rules. They are the problem, not the motorist who is obeying the basic traffic rule. Unfortunately motorists make mistakes and hit bicyclists, occasionally with fatal results. I don't believe that any motorist has intentionally done so. However it is this sociopathic persona we pin on motorists that make a cooperative sharing of the road so difficult. We all need to grow up and be reposible for our own behavior, stop blaming others and share the road.
Regardless of the issue, the us vs. them mentality does not build community, I don't care what way you spin it.
Brad thank you for your post.
July 10th, 2008 11:23
My favorite part of this story is the mob mentality of the 25 other people that came to the defense of an aggressive drunk asshat.
In the alleged "Us vs. Them" debate it is painfully obvious that those of us on bikes are much more discriminatory in this regard. A much stronger sense of "Us" as a bike riding community, as evidenced by all these people coming to the defense of the wrong person. It is too bad.
July 10th, 2008 11:27
great! now i get to enjoy some motorist thinking they are justified in harassing me on my way home.
July 10th, 2008 11:27
Would the driver pull up to a car and "chide" him/her for making car drivers look bad for running a red light? Don't think so. If you open up your mouth and criticize someone, expect that there may be consequences.
July 10th, 2008 11:33
It seems like the only time these outraged motorists actually see cyclists is when they do something wrong, not when they are taking a left turn in front of one, or right-hooking one. I also have to wonder if they are as outraged when they see a fellow motorist run a stop sign or a stoplight, which is much more life-threatening than a bicyclist could ever be.
July 10th, 2008 11:38
Actually, I think the Oregonian story was pretty good. It portrayed Colin Yates, the driver of the car fair enough. From the story, I didn't get the impression that Yates antagonized McAtee, the guy on the bike.
The story told it pretty straight: Yates commented that McAtee was being irresponsible and then blocks later, the drunken McAtee went out of his way to escalate the situation, going so far as to use his bike to strike Colin Yates car and his person. Only an idiot drunk would do something so stupid as that. Absolutely if the driver of the car had been a cop, McAtee would have been promptly tased or shot dead on the spot.
"Suddenly, out of nowhere, a passer-by knocked McAtee to the ground with one punch." Oregonian article
No kid gloves there, but better than being shot dead.
I suppose the nature of McAtee's job might be important here. Citizens of Portland most likely feel the city, as a rule, had better be hiring people that can conduct themselves off the job as well as on the job, better than Portland's transportation department building plan examiner Steven McAtee does.
July 10th, 2008 11:38
Thank you, Jonathan. There is as much of a "bicycle community" as there is a "motorist community." Neither label furthers the discussion.
In my opinion, Colin Yates' actions were those of a good citizen. I'm more concerned with anyone who advocates turning a blind eye to irresponsible, out of control, unsafe behavior. It's a concept that transcends bikes and cars.
July 10th, 2008 11:42
Sadly the reality of the situation is that there will probably be more altercations like this than less.
There are more cyclists on the road than ever. They are present for multiple of reasons. So this is a fact that people need to accept.
What everyone utilizing our roads and paths need to remember that we all have a constitutional right to travel. So, when an irresponsible motorist, finally loses his/her license, cycling is still a viable mode of transportation. Unfortunately, these same drivers probably cycle in a similarly irresponsible fashion. Therefore, in all groups, there always is a percentage of individuals on the fringe, be they “scofflaws†or “hyper-vigilantâ€. Cycling, as a group will accumulate an even greater number of “irresponsible and irreverent†personalities. Those who present licensure of cyclists as a way to prevent this will find it will not be so simple. Preservation of non-licensed forms of transportation, such as cycling is essential to maintaining the constitutionality of a state’s power of revocation for licensed forms of transportation.
Which irresponsible traveler do you want off the road, the driver of a 2 ton vehicle or the rider of a 20 lb bike?
Personally, I am focusing on reducing the number of individuals carelessly converting their cars into lethal weapons, educating all members of traffic and improving infrastructure for safe traffic flow.
[Responsible media coverage and enforcement contribute to education]
July 10th, 2008 11:50
Comment on oregonlive.com about the cyclist altercation:
I am glad I moved out of Portland to a small town. Where if I have to wait for more than three cars it's rush hour. You folks take care in the big city. . Come on mayor Stham Adamths do the right thing here
Yes, come on mayor stham adamths, do the right thing. This small town feller writes with a lisp and like his pie appleth.
July 10th, 2008 11:52
I have known Colin for over 17 years. He has worked in the bike industry for almost as long as I have been alive. Colin is one of the most bike conscious people I know, he has also commuted by bike more miles that 99% of the population will ever ride in their lifetimes.
It is a pity that he has been dragged into this situation and had his reputation put into question.
I for one stand by Colin Yates as an honorable and decent Human Being.
I call on anyone else that knows Colin to submit to this column and support Him.
It’s a pity he is on vacation and cannot be here to defend himself from the vitrol I am seeing spewed about him.
July 10th, 2008 11:52
Every single day during my commute I see other cyclists blow red lights. If I get a chance, I call them on it, although I need to do a better job of doing it politely. It's not self-righteousness, it's self-preservation.
People riding recklessly makes drivers angry which puts my life and well-being at risk. Face it folks, riding a bike does not imbue you with a moral superiority that entitles you to disobey the traffic laws at your whim. Cyclists get outraged when their riding angers a motorist because the cyclist has cost the driver a few seconds, yet some cyclists feel that they shouldn't have to stop at a light because it will cost them a few seconds on their trip. What hypocrisy. I am as strong an advocate for cycling as anyone and don't downplay the relative risk in a car-bike confrontation, but I am sick of the true self-righteousness and twisted sense of entitlement displayed by so many of my fellow cyclists.
That all being said, I think Yates made two mistakes, honking his horn and trying to confront a cyclist from a car. As much as a self-appointed cop as I may be, two things I would not do.
July 10th, 2008 11:53
It seems like many of the comments on here are well thought out. I would venture that people who are invested in Portland's cycling community are also those who can see the big picture, and that is why they can see this issue as a person v. person issue, an anger management issue, a warning of what happens when you drink too much, etc.
I also can appreciate the outlandish comments--I may not agree with them, but just being aware those people are out there, thinking what they think (on both sides of the coin) can help me understand where someone is coming from.
I think that most cyclists are never noticed by cars because car drivers are too focused on the road, not the shoulders of the road. Also because many cyclists choose to ride on residential streets, trails, or during off-peak hours. I myself have ridden downtown only once, and was almost hit twice by cars trying to parallel park or leave a parking spot.
Many of the roads in PDX were designed with cars in mind, so it's that much harder for everyone to come to a balance. Personally, I like that All State Insurance commercial that illustrates how everyone on the road is a person...not a "car" or a "bike"...and that it's everyone's responsibility.
Keep the discussion going. Eventually we'll get somewhere!
July 10th, 2008 11:54
I wish bicyclists who blow stop signs realized the implications of their actions... not so much the implications of their own health or wellbeing or whatnot, although of course that is very important.
Rather, I wish they would realize the implications for cycling as a culture, and the implications for other cyclists who do obey the law and ride safer.
When bicyclists are perceived as rowdy, inconsiderate, dangerous, wreckless or non-law abiding by everybody in a car based on what they are seeing in front of them out of their windshields, it affects ##so## much!
It affects whether the bicycle community gets funding for projects. It affects the wellbeing and standing of cyclists who are careful and DO obey the law.
Case in point. While I was bicycling the Columbia Gorge Historic Highway, a passing car hurled a beer can at me hard as it passed. The beer can hit my bike, exploded, and soaked me.
I caught up with the car at Crown Point, and asked the man what the heck he was doing. His response? He just laughed and said "You bicyclists are all the same, you run red lights, run stop signs, and you totally deserved it" before driving off agressively. He did this to me, irregardless of the fact I was riding perfectly legally.
This guy felt he had the right to injure me - a girl he didn't even know - based on what he sees out there on the streets with bikes every day of his life.
It was pretty upsetting needless to say.
July 10th, 2008 11:55
#62 and #74 are correct. I don't understand how some of you feel that one should mind one's own business when they see someone put the lives of themselves and others at risk.
July 10th, 2008 11:57
Steve’s behavior was disgusting. I was shocked as the Steve I know is a kind, soft spoken guy. It is now apparent to all Greater Portland that Steve has a problem or two. Drinking and anger come to mind.
His job as a city employee has nothing to do with this situation and I am not sure what the Oregonian felt the need to mention it. Should every city employee that receives a DUI, gets arrested, or does something stupid when they're drunk be fired from their job?
July 10th, 2008 12:00
The rider was intoxicated, ie, actively in violation of the law. He's in the wrong. Blowing a stop sign, drunk...he deserves to go to jail.
I agree with those that don't condone a double-standard for bad behavior on two wheels vs four.
I'm deeply disappointed bikeportland.org is failing to address the issue of riding while intoxicated. It's inexcusable in any vehicle.
July 10th, 2008 12:02
Correction: Colin is not on vacation.
He has moved to Colorado.
Great going away present from Portland.
July 10th, 2008 12:06
I am a new cyclist yet have to drive my car to work. I cross the Springwater Corridor trail at Stanley every day in my car. I'm amazed at the number of cyclists that blow through the stop signs and then have the audacity to yell at the cars that come close to hitting them.
Another interesting area is cycling etiquette while on paths. I thought we, as cyclists, were supposed to do things such as let a walker/bike know we were passing and on what side and I practice this every time I'm on my bike. However I can't count the close calls I've had from other cyclists that don't practice this.
What gives??? I love to bike and do so every night...but I don't know who is the worst...the bikes or the cars!!
July 10th, 2008 12:08
Ironic that just a few days after a horrific holiday road rage incident down here in LA - car against bike, a severed nose, 90 stitches, extended ER visits, broken bones etc - y'all flip the script up in allegedly bike-friendlier Portland.
http://www.latimes.com/news/local/la-me-bike9-2008jul09,0,6023414.story
Given that the LA Times story about the Mandeville Canyon incident has resulted in 160 jackholes and counting commenting that the cyclists deserved to get hit, not to mention a ton of folks calling and emailing threats to the numerous doctors sharing the same name as the perpetrator are representative of how foolish both sides can act when anger overtakes logic. Which, IMHO is what y'all are experiencing up north - violence begets violence. We can't 'all just get along' if everyone takes it as their right to fly off the handle based on a limited perspective of a given event. Both stories prove that before any true sharing of the road can go on, people on two and four wheels need to figure out how to keep emotions in check and be rational in how they view the world they're trying to participate in.
July 10th, 2008 12:10
Seems I'm not the only one.
_______
That diver was talking down to cyclists! I'd like to cut his nuts off!
---say that again?, What? my mic is on?
oh shit...
July 10th, 2008 12:12
This has nothing to do with obeying traffic laws. just another motorist picking on a cyclist because it's easy.
July 10th, 2008 12:14
Just when I thought my little protest of the bike boxes got blown out of proportion (both here and through some misquoting by Portland Tribune), I read this FRONT PAGE, TOP-HALF article in the Oregonian, a nationally-respected and recognized professional newspaper, and my freaking jaw just dropped. My respect for them, simply as a objective new source, completely removed from all things cycling, has just dropped significantly. At least put it in the Metro section! How the hell did this happen?!? Very poor reporting IMO and very irresponsible, which says nothing of the content of the article, which is just as bad. FRONT PAGE!?!?! What editor would be so insane as to let this happen!?!?
BTW, I will personally vouch for Colin, he is a good guy and well-meaning with all things cycling. I worked under him when I first started working at the BG several years ago. I'm sure this was a huge misunderstanding, both in the events that precipitated and in the awful reporting done by the Oregonian. Shame on the Oregonian, SHAME!!
July 10th, 2008 12:17
jc (#51) - wow, thanks for that equally inappropriate reaction. Why should McAtee lose his job with the city? Unless he did this during work hours while acting as a city employee, his behavior has no bearing on his job. You're advocating a reaction that amounts to a personal vendetta - the same level of over-reaction that McAtee is (apparently) guilty of in this instance. He should be punished for his crime, sure - but that's it.
sarah (#76) - the city puts police on administrative leave when they screw up on duty. They put school teachers on leave when the teacher is accused of a crime involving students. Administrative leave is a protective measure for the community when there is question as to whether the behavior of the employee directly puts the community at risk. Unless McAtee did this on city time, I don't see how it affects his job or the community-at-large. If he's convicted of assault, then the city has every right to fire him, but at the moment it's unclear to me how putting him on leave (which gives him opportunity to be depressed and possibly drink) is more beneficial to the community than allowing him to work his job.
July 10th, 2008 12:20
As a bike commuter in this town, I've got to say that the RED LIGHT running by bikes drives me nuts. Stop signs I can understand (when are we going to that slow and go Idaho law), half the time the person in the car will wave me through, but the red light thing just pisses me off... and I'm on my bike!
I think it's the ONE shining example of behavior that gets people to say stuff like:
JC - 51
"This is exactly the problem I have with alot of bicyclists in this town. They feel entitled and that they deserve something because they are riding a bike. But in fact, most of them are aggressive, do not obey traffic laws and ride drunk more than we would like to think."
July 10th, 2008 12:22
Too many cyclists do not find it necessary to follow the traffic laws. I am an avid cyclist and I get cursed when I point out the failure to stop at a red light or stop sign. We in the cycling community need to step up and police ourselves and follow the rules.
July 10th, 2008 12:29
"There are a lot of latent death-threats in the Oregonians comments section, which is scary." - post #35
Use the 'Alert Us' link and let them know. They've taken down a couple of comments that I flagged as violent.
July 10th, 2008 12:31
The story belongs on a local news inside page, not the lead story but that's water under the bridge at this point.
News seems to always follow the mantra, "if it bleeds, it leads." I'd love to see a front page story, "Forty thousand cyclists commute around Portland today without incident." Portland residents collectively saved 14,000 gallons of gas or $56,000. This reduced our carbon footprint by xyz.
July 10th, 2008 12:34
I think Brad (post #42) hit the nail on the head. We (cyclists) need to act responsibly if we ever want to be taken seriously on the road. If we behave like we are children riding toys, then we will get no respect from the public. And that goes for extremist, recreational, racer, and commuter cyclists alike.
July 10th, 2008 12:34
i've been scolded by drivers on days when i've forgotten my helmet or i didn't have a headlight after dark. i was annoyed, but i didn't nearly approach smash-them-with-my-bicycle levels of rage. whatever happens to mr. mcatee, i hope it involves anger management training.
July 10th, 2008 12:37
A. He was drunk.
B. He works for Sam.
C. End of story.
July 10th, 2008 12:38
Agree with the poster a ways up who pointed out that the Oregonian is nothing but sensationalistic trash. It's a sure thing that we've come to a pretty scary point when the Tribune is gaining more & more acceptance as a reliable and trust-worthy medium for local news coverage.
I like when they (Oregonian) run those big 57-point font, attention grabbing headlines relating to some trade the Blazers made or whatever (and I'm a Blazer fan and avid cyclist -- I just don't think either of these things, especially in these particular instances -- warrant the kind of "coverage" that crap paper gives them.) Sad.
July 10th, 2008 12:41
The guy was riding alone at night and was threatened by a car full
of people. The assymmetry in the encounter demands that the cyclist
turn to defensive measures. There is no time to try to understand
what every car is yelling when you are a cyclist trying not to die
on americas roads.
If you threaten a cyclist from a car, and then proceed to get out of
your vehicle, then you are attacking the cyclist. That must be the
cyclist's first assumption. In that situation, counter-attack and
the highest level of defense are appropriate.
My riding a bike is not an open invitation for you to make any
comments whatsoever from a vehicle, especially threatening ones. It
doesn't matter whether you have some point to make. Do you start up
a discussion with every car that doesn't use the turn signal ? NO !
So do not initiate any threatening demands from your vehicle while
I am cycling or you will receive the appropriate counter measures.
The hypocritical car cheaters just speed away like cowards if they
don't like the situation. And yet turn around and demand that a
cyclist stop on the spot and engage in some conversation. Rediculous.
And finally, I completely disagree, the way you choose to transport
yourself does, more than many things, paint a picture of your
personality.
Peace to all -RD-
July 10th, 2008 12:43
"Chastising a reckless jerk is in the same league as assault and battery, Icarus?" (comment #69)
Rixtir,
Yelling anything at a reckless jerk is inviting escalation of the situation.
In fact, yelling anything at anybody at anytime is inviting escalation of a situation.
This is not in any manner excusing the idiot moves of the drunk cyclist.
But it also does not take partial fault away from the driver.
Had he just driven safely away with his family, without honking, yelling at, following, then chastising the cyclist, there would be a different outcome to this situation.
When driving around cyclists, or even biking around cyclists, there are certain responsibilities involved.
One of the major ones is "Protect your Family!" Even if it means dropping any thoughts you may have of supposed "bicycle advocacy".
Protecting your family does not involve honking, then yelling at a cyclist, which in turn is no different than putting your family in harms way.
Not to mention the lesson learned by your children that it may be OK to yell and honk angrily at cyclists from the safety of your car.
Protecting your family means being the bigger person, and slowly driving away without saying a word to the offender.
Possibly calling the authorities if you feel there is some danger to others on the road.
Instead, it sadly became some sort of insane invitation for a drunk moron to attack the metal bubble you had strapped your family into.
Also, honking at a cyclist, whether out of rage or love, gets one response.
The cyclist turns their head to look the direction of the honk/yell. This will probably result in a swerve of the bicycle, which can result quickly in injury or death. It is well known, even on a heavier motorcycle, that the result of a head turn, and the corresponding drop of the shoulder, results in the vehicle turning the direction of the head turn. This is not as prevelant on a motorcycle as on a bicycle, due to the power plant pushing the motorcycle forward faster than pedal power, but it does happen.
Now, on to advocacy. Advocacy is not something that is yelled from a car window, or expressed by honking your horn.
I cannot tell you the number of times "bicycle advocates" have chastized me for a untold number of things, mostly while riding safely. And many times, the way they come across to you does nothing more than get your endorphines in a bunch, and your response is not generally pleasant.
The above was my response to Rixtir's question about my comment.
Once again, I do not condone the actions of the cyclist involved in this mess.
I also do not condone those around him on bicycles allowing this to escalate.
Had I been there, and seen him attacking a car with a family in it, and swinging his bike at a man, I would have done my best to knock him out cold. Or at least subdue him. I would have then helped to deliver his ass to the police.
Thank you, and have a good day!
July 10th, 2008 12:43
Kay: "He did this to me, irregardless of the fact I was riding perfectly legally."
"irregardless" is not a real word.
July 10th, 2008 12:46
I like some of what I've heard here. The absolute truth is that separation is the enemy. All of us are people. There is no cycling community as much as there isn't a motorist community. People's need to separate themselves from other for the purpose of feeling elite about what they do or creating some sort of rivalry that only exists in their mind, that is the enemy. I drive a lot and bike a lot. I see both perspectives and people in general make me mad on the road, but taking the stand that you are on one side or the other is ridiculous. So you don't drive? That doesn't make you special. So you don't ride a bike? That doesn't make you special either. People just choose different means of transport. When you get any large number of people interacting with each other someone is bound to get pissed at someone else because lets face it we all can't be calm and collected all the time. Lets just remember were a