Users of the popular Sandy Ridge MTB Trail System are speaking out about an unidentified couple they say has repeatedly threatened and assaulted people during and after their bike rides.
According to allegations, an “older couple” has hiked up the mountain bike trails from the parking lot and “accosted” riders.
Members of the Sandy Ridge Trailhead Mountain Bikers Facebook group have been discussing the incidents since last month. One member of the group, Brian F., described an incident he claims took place on February 26th:
“last night the crazy gun toting, bear mace your dog couple struck again to my friend m***** in the lower parking lot. the woman maced ender, the dog… the older man has pulled his weapon on 2 of my friends in the parking lot and the woman carries a can of bear mace, they dont like dogs or bikers and hike the trails.”
Following this incident, the couple was followed home and their address was reportedly handed over to law enforcement.
Another Sandy Ridge trail user we’ve been in contact with via email said several other groups of riders have also had confrontations with this same couple. It’s not clear why the couple is targeting mountain bikers; but some suspect they are particularly annoyed with the riders’ off-leash dogs (UPDATE: We have heard about more incidents and it is now clear they are directing their rage at mountain bike riders in general, and not just dogs).
(It’s worth noting that the Sandy Ridge Trail System was developed by the International Mountain Bicycling Association and the Bureau of Land Management specifically as a mountain bike riding area. As such, it has become a very popular regional riding destination and it’s not that common to see people hiking on the trails.)
We first heard about the incidents last week and we are still following up with local authorities to learn more. There are three agencies that have jurisdiction at and around Sandy Ridge: The BLM, the Clackamas County Sheriff’s Office, and the Portland Water Bureau.
The Water Bureau has a stake in Sandy Ridge because of it’s proximity to the Bull Run watershed. Their public information officer, Tim Hall, said he’s been notified by the Clackamas County Sheriff’s Office about the situation, but so far he’s not aware of any trail users that have come forward to file an official complaint against the couple. Hall confirmed that Water Bureau security guards are aware of mace being used on a dog and officers have interacted with the couple. Hall says the couple hike the trails a lot and “They’re fearful of the dogs going off leash.” Hall added that Water Bureau security officers have passed the case on to the Clackamas County Sheriff’s Office.
Clackamas County Deputy Sheriff Joshua Griffin told us he’s aware of the incidents in the area; but that there is not active investigation at this time. (Some of the trail users are skeptical about law enforcement getting involved because no one has gotten hurt yet.) We’ve left a message with the Sheriff’s Office public information officer to learn if any other other investigations have been opened.
We’ll continue to follow this case and post updates as warranted.
In the meantime, if you have come in contact with this couple or if you have more information about these incidents, please call the Clackamas County Sheriff’s Office non-emergency line at (503) 655-8211.
UPDATE, 3/12 at 11:00 am We can now confirm that the CCSO has an open and ongoing investigation into this matter. That being said they urge everyone who has had interactions with this couple to call and file a report.
UPDATE: A reader has shared another encounter with this same couple.
On May 12th 2013 my family and I had a run in with them and I can tell you that friendliness was not on there minds.
I had just gotten to the end of the trail by the yellow gate near the old parking area. I was the first one to the bottom so I turned and looked up the trail to watch the rest of my family come down. I heard the couple yelling so I looked to my right and saw the them walking towards me from the main road. I couldn’t make out what they were saying but my focus was on my daughter her boyfriend and my wife and two dogs who were just coming down. As we exchanged hi fives and started to talk about what a great day it was we herd a fast clicking sound. We looked and saw the woman had a stun gun and was walking towards my dogs.
I have two miniature Australian Shepherds that don’t even weigh 20 pounds each. this woman was not afraid of my dogs she was pursuing them with a weapon.
We yelled at them to leave the dogs alone and then there focus shifted towards us.
They were at this point within a yard or two from us screaming and yelling incoherently when my wife said don’t shock my dogs and the woman then pointed the stun gun at her with her finger on the trigger sparkling it and taking steps towards her. Then my 16 year old daughter yelled leave my mom alone. The woman then went after her.
I had had enough!
I picked up my bike to use as a shield and that’s when the guy pulled the gun and stuck it in my face. I stood there yelling at my family to leave. Once they were clear I started to tell him to relax don’t shoot me. That’s when I noticed his eyes bulging and he was hyperventilating. I walked backwards dragging my bike until I got to the trail that leads back to the big parking lot. I jumped on my bike with my back turned to him expecting to be shot as I road away.
These people are using being afraid of dogs as an excuse to carry out violent confrontations with mountain bikers
The police were called and a few weeks later we went to the police station and did a line up.
It is extremely disappointing to hear that it has happened again.
I can tell you that in no way are these people victims!
Thanks for reading.
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Wsbob and Marcy Houle? I kid…
Wasn’t me either
Would you like to borrow a mountain bike and go out there tomorrow? I have an extra and am happy to drive. We would have a blast! Sixty degrees… the dirt will be perfect. Too bad you associate yourself with those folks.
Ain’t me…wouldn’t be me…not my style.
“…Hall confirmed that Water Bureau security guards are aware of mace being used on a dog and officers have interacted with the couple. Hall says the couple hike the trails a lot and “They’re fearful of the dogs going off leash.” …” maus/bikeportand
More about what additional information may have been exchanged during that interaction between officers and the two people, could possibly be helpful.
I wondered if anybody coming to ride in this park, upon encountering the two people on the trails or seeing them in the parking lot, has made some effort to be friendly, enter into congenial conversation…and vice-versa.
Reading articles about SR here at bikeportland, I know that the park is primarily dedicated to off-road biking. Other people may not be so familiar with the recreational purpose the park has been primarily been designated to serve. I can’t make out the small print on the sign in the picture illustrating this story. Is that a county park sign? Do signs in the parking lot and whatever website offers information about the park, convey that this is primarily an off-road biking park?
There could be a range of reasons why these two people have conducted themselves the way they did. Hopefully, somebody will be able to, in a way that isn’t antagonistic, discover what those reasons are, and resolve the issues in a neighborly manner.
I believe I have seen them and I have been friendly. Mtbers are generally a pretty friendly bunch. It is the hikers that I am more worried about – the bring guns and mace.
Fishing line across the trail more your style? I kid…
Like mtbers, gun owners are generally a pretty friendly bunch. Just don’t cross ’em.
Please stop that kind of kidding…once was o.k., but it’s not funny anymore.
This is a serious kind of situation that can get out of control if people aren’t careful. If you’ve been friendly upon encountering the people in question…I’m glad, thank you, that was the right thing to do.
If they didn’t respond in kind by being friendly, that’s unfortunate. If they really have been displaying firearms, rather than simply ‘weapons’ such as pepper spray or mace, the police are going to have to investigate the situation to find out if their reasons for doing so had any justification.
This kind of situation ought to be able to be resolved without some major catastrophe occurring, but if people treat it instead as opportunity to beat up on each other, it may not go well.
It was ribbing you and not making light of the situation at Sandy. I agree it is very serious – I spend a lot of time out there and have put in a lot of work out there. I would highly prefer to not get shot or have bear spray used on me.
On a side and more serious note: what more is there that can be done about this situation? It would be nice to not feel like there is a potential of getting shot when I am out there alone. Have the authorities said they are going to do anything about this? How much contact has there been with these people by the authorities?
“…what more is there that can be done about this situation?…” Alex
Authorities had better investigate, and soon. It sounds as though they may already have done some of that. Without investigating, it’s very hard to really know for certain from people’s stories passed around, what the situation is. Authorities should offer as much info as they can, about what they’ve found out.
Chris Hess’s story is startling. A police lineup to identify people he and his family claims were attacking with stun guns and threatening with firearms? Tell us if you were able to pick someone out of the lineup. Not who, just if.
On May 12th 2013 my family and I had a run in with them and I can tell you that friendliness was not on there minds.
I had just gotten to the end of the trail by the yellow gate near the old parking area. I was the first one to the bottom so I turned and looked up the trail to watch the rest of my family come down. I heard the couple yelling so I looked to my right and saw the them walking towards me from the main road. I couldn’t make out what they were saying but my focus was on my daughter her boyfriend and my wife and two dogs who were just coming down. As we exchanged hi fives and started to talk about what a great day it was we herd a fast clicking sound. We looked and saw the woman had a stun gun and was walking towards my dogs.
I have two miniature Australian Shepherds that don’t even weigh 20 pounds each. this woman was not afraid of my dogs she was pursuing them with a weapon.
We yelled at them to leave the dogs alone and then there focus shifted towards us.
They were at this point within a yard or two from us screaming and yelling incoherently when my wife said don’t shock my dogs and the woman then pointed the stun gun at her with her finger on the trigger sparkling it and taking steps towards her. Then my 16 year old daughter yelled leave my mom alone. The woman then went after her.
I had had enough!
I picked up my bike to use as a shield and that’s when the guy pulled the gun and stuck it in my face. I stood there yelling at my family to leave. Once they were clear I started to tell him to relax don’t shoot me. That’s when I noticed his eyes bulging and he was hyperventilating. I walked backwards dragging my bike until I got to the trail that leads back to the big parking lot. I jumped on my bike with my back turned to him expecting to be shot as I road away.
These people are using being afraid of dogs as an excuse to carry out violent confrontations with mountain bikers
The police were called and a few weeks later we went to the police station and did a line up.
It is extremely disappointing to hear that it has happened again.
I can tell you that in no way are these people victims!
Bit of a cliffhanger ending…did you pick them out of the lineup? How was the situation resolved? Was the Clackamas County Sheriff’s office involved? (If so, their apparent lack of concern about additional incidents seems kind of odd.)
some day they will pull a gun on somebody with a conceal carry permit and will find themselves dead…
I agree. These people are not hiking/walking to enjoy nature. They are aggressively & purposely going out of their way to confront people to threaten others with their weapons. I had an encounter 5 years ago with them. I don’t bike but I liked to walk up the road since I live on Barlow Trail. The bikers I saw were friendly & courteous but this couple is crazy. My dog was limping so I walked him over to the side of the road took off his leash and let him drink water in the small creek. Then from a far I heard yelling & screaming. Since they were far away I had no idea it was directed @ me. As I put Leo’s leash back on the woman approached me from behind and said “don’t let your dog near me I have spray and he has a gun.” My first thought was, this lady was crazy and just ignore her cause I felt my talking to her would lead to no good. If they are so scared of dogs why would they go out of their way to come up to dogs? Both me & my dog ignored her and left. Later on another walk I saw a police guard so I told him about my encounter. He said they had lots of reports about them but they couldn’t do anything until they break the law. I said to him “like if the shoot & kill some one?” He didn’t really respond. Shortly after my encounter with these people my dog, Leo was diagnosed with bone cancer and died and I haven’t been walking up the road. I see this couple walk thru the town of Brightwood heading towards Barlow Trail almost every day between 4-5 PM. If fact I saw them today 3/19/14 waking back from Barlow Trail @ 5PM. Because my encounter was 5 years ago I don’t know if it will have an impact but I think this crazy couple should be banned from any hiking trails, especially Sandy Ridge. The road can be shared with bikers & walkers but the trails should only be used by bikers. You would have to be stupid/crazy to think hiking on these trails is a good idea. This couple is feeding off of their mental illness and are dangerous!
The woman maced a dog and the guy pulled a gun, it already is out of control.
Apparently they have been hiking that road for years… illegally. Access was restricted before the area was built. Local entitlement??? I prefer the Surf Punk’s take on “locals only”. Odd that “they” are allowed to be antagonistic and the victim isn’t. q ‘ Tzal is correct in regards to someone getting hurt. Hey Folks, this is not a dog issue. This is an example of two crazy people who assess their situation and react like “crazy people”. Go ahead and blame the victim. Maybe the dogs were dressed in a suggestive manner.
LOL, I gotta see that picture.
The area has never been restricted to hikers. I live a few miles from there and have for 20+ years. Only at the top of the road – in the Bull Run Watershed is the general public access restricted. The gate was to stop illegal dumping I believe.
I’ve lived here in Brightwood for over 30 years. We use to be able to drive up this road to get our Christmas trees. Only the gate up top that lead to the Bull Run area was restricted. The gate at the bottom was put later because of dumping and other problems with people driving up it but you could still walk the road.
I have lived in Brightwood for over 30 years. I guess you could say I am “over-the hill.” I use to drive up it when I was younger and when they put the gate up I walked it with my dog. When the bike trails were made I was happy to see trails for bikers. I continued walking and had good encounters with people biking. I felt safer with more people around too. Walkers/hikers have no right in the bike trails but sharing the road was no problem. Everything was fine until I had an encounter with this “mad” couple. Funny thing was that I would see them every day walking & I though “what a cute couple” walking every day & thought if I ever have a chance I would complement them. I couldn’t wait to retire and walk everyday too. So I had nothing but good thoughts about them till they went OUT OF THEIR WAY to threaten my dog & me. They are NOT afraid of dogs. They are using this as an excuse to be aggressive. They are MAD DOGS! . . . but really they are mentally ill. I hope the authorities do something before there is a tragedy. And please people let the police handle this. “Two wrongs don’t make a right.”
Ugggghhh, one more reason to hate cat people.
Bullshit. My dog is a “cat person”, and he hasn’t pulled a piece on anyone.
Brandishing a firearm and no open investigation?
Case,
I think the issue is that they’ve threatened to use a firearm… Not that one has been seen and/or brandished.
Not according to this account:
“the older man has pulled his weapon on 2 of my friends in the parking lot”
If nothing else, law enforcement should at least be investigating to determine exactly what has happened in regards to the reported brandishing and use of weapons.
That quote from the FB group says “the older man has pulled his weapon on 2 of my friends in the parking lot”. Seems pretty outrageous…what was it that the NRA said about good guys and bad guys with guns, again? Which one is this guy?
Oh yeah. You guys are right . My mistake. Still, those FB postings are all just allegations and so far, no law enforcement authorities have confirmed that a weapon was seen and/or brandished during any of the incidents.
Someone who’s gonna get himself shot.
Not all MTBers are liberal, pinko gun haters who’ll just roll over. Somebody on a bike is going to show up well armed and “stand his ground”.
The only reason for the police not to get involved is because they want the old guy and his wife to be beaten up or shot by someone who refused to be bullied.
or roll by…….
I was thinking the same thing. That guy is going to pull his gun on the wrong person and then things are going downhill fast. One rule is that you don’t pull a gun unless you’re going to use it, so the next guy is likely to draw & shoot, not realizing that this guy just likes to wave his around.
“I picked up my bike to use as a shield and that’s when the guy pulled the gun and stuck it in my face.”
sticking a gun in someones face is assault with a deadly weapon. i believe people go to prison for that. if someone threatened my dog or sprayed it with bear mace they would have to shoot me to stop me from hurting them. these people sound straight up evil and yet a lot of folks on here are defending them? i dont understand.
If someone maces your dog and you in turn attack them, you are going to find yourself in a lot of trouble. I say this as a dog owner.
MTBers.
Just get their license plate number and call the cops. These people seem like entitled psychos with nothing to lose, let the authorities take care of these fools.
On a side note, if they have an axe to grind about off leash dogs they should head over to forest park where the pristine wildness of that area is over-run with off leash dogs and not a mountain biker in sight.
They are a local couple who walk the road everyday…I am also local and ride the trail often…unleashed dogs on the trail are not cool at all and dangerous…fast moving bikes and dogs dont mix…keep the dogs at home or in the car…
Don’t ever keep a dog in a car. Leave them at home please.
If you must leave your dog in the car you should return every 30 minutes to baste them.
It sounds like they followed the people home. Not sure if that meant on foot, or by car. Brightwood has a lot of good locals, but there are a lot of nuts in that area as well.
The same type of people that tear down the volleyball nets when they are up at Brightwood beach.
All the more reason to build more trail IN PORTLAND!
No room for trails, we’re building apartment buildings!
The pristine acres of english ivy you mean.
Eric my tongue is in my cheek on that one.
While I don’t agree with their methods I really dislike off leash pets also. I know of at least one rider who broke a collar bone after getting tangled up with an off leash dog (not at Sandy Ridge). BLM states: “Pets are allowed on public lands must be on a leash or otherwise controlled when in developed recreation sites. Pets should not create a hazard or nuisance for other visitors or harass wildlife.”
The leash rules are not an excuse for assaulting anyone and these people should be arrested.
If you enjoy riding or hiking and seeing wild life like I do – leave your pet at home or put it on a leash.
I know that if Portland Parks ever wanted to raise some serious $$, all they would have to do is fine people for having their dog off leash in parks land.
These two people are dangerous cranks.
That being said, I still detest Portland’s large community of entitled dog owners. Just three days ago, I had an off-leash German Shepherd lunge at me while I was running at Mt. Tabor. “It’s okay, you just scared him…”
I run with my dogs at Mt. Tabor, ON leash, of course. You can imagine how much worse it is when these off leash “well behaved” dogs encounter other dogs. I’ve considered carrying my bear spray at times, and I have had to kick other dogs before.
Thank you! At Tabor, it sometimes seems like you’re in the minority of dog owners….
My neighbor who has a rescue boxer thanks you for keeping your dog on a leash. She has worked very hard with the dog- he’s a good boy- but she hates it when unleashed dogs get in her dog’s face.
Amen! We’ve had our beagle and our late (died of old age, not attack) chihuahua mix chewed up by larger off-leash dogs. It’s really a stupid, careless, hick thing to do to let your large dog wander off-leash.
These people are not “afraid” of dogs. They are the “mad dog”. They go out of their way to confront & threaten people. If they had so much Fear” of dogs they wouldn’t purposely go out of their way to go up to the dogs & bring out their weapons. They are SICK!
I once had an off-leash dog run directly in front of my front wheel. I did a Superman over the handlebars. The last thing I remember is the thump of my wheel hitting the dog; the next thing I remember is the sounds in the emergency room when I woke up partially blinded 2 hrs later with severe concussion (despite wearing my helmet). It took 4 more months of partial blackouts and unpredictable dizzy spells before I returned to normal. I don’t blame the dog-I blame the owner for not keeping their animal under control. Dogs & bikes don’t mix well. In this case the owners got off cheap; their insurance company ended up settling for only $4600.
For the rider who takes a dog along for a romp there’s a catch-22. If they let the dog go off-leash they risk doing serious injury to someone else, but if they put the dog on a leash, then they risk getting tangled up with the dog themselves. I shudder every time I see a cyclist doing this. Best practice – leave the dog home or take it to an off-leash facility.
Yes, dog owners need to be respectful of this and walkers on the road shouldn’t hike the designated “bike” trails. But, this couple is different! They are mentally ill! They are not walking to enjoy nature. They are like some people that get drunk and try to pick fights with people! They are using dogs as an excuse to threaten other’s with their weapons. They are the MAD DOGS! Do we need for someone to get shot/killed to understand this?
Time for the GoPro or Contour footage. If anyone has any, send to the authorities.
Of the off-leash dogs?
From what Jonathan’s written, it seems like these people have an issue with dogs off leash. Keep ’em on a leash or under _really good_ voice control. Our dog is off leash _at home_. Anywhere else; on leash.
That being said, q’Tzal has a point, these people’s behavior, if left unchecked, is likely to lead to violence against them.
worth nothing that the trail map clearly has the trails marked as one direction, down, the road is the only way up. so if they are hiking up trails from the lot they are going the wrong way, and putting themselves and the people using the trails in the correct direction in danger. kind of hard to enforce one rule, leash, while you are breaking another.
meant “worth noting” but “worth nothing” works also
The map that I downloaded from the link clearly says: Recommended Direction of Travel
Am I the only person who clicked through envisioning a couple in SCA gear prowling Sandy Ridge with a medieval mace?
YUP
Invitation is still open. SSPD or full suspension? Clipless or flats? Prefer after 10:00 am. Bluebird day for sure…
That sounds great actually. (Clipless) Can’t do it, Gotta work. I could put knobbies on my hard tail commuter. I am not against all mt biking, but I don’t think they should be allowed everywhere. Sandy Ridge is designated, well maintained and appropriate use. Thank you for the invitation. I will get up there this spring for sure.
You made my day! Thank you and cheers.
Dark Age Crank Yankers LARP?
Like this guy?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IpqZPPiIayI
Off leash dogs spread noxious weed seed and promote invasive species spreading when running around trail systems. That’s just what I read somewhere.
Lol.. And wild animals don’t?
I have talked with a few people who have encountered these people on the trail and they are very against MTBs on the trails and not just against off leash dogs. Once again just call the cops on people who brandish guns no need to live your chuck norris fantasy.
This wouldn’t be a problem if all dogs using the trail were required to carry handguns.
Those &@#^ pedestrians should be required to have license plates so they can be identified.
Do these people prefer the Motos that used to (actually still do) rip around, all over those hills…?
On a side note. I can’t effing stand people and their goddamned dogs on the trail. Leave them at home. The next dog that takes off from its owner and stands at the bottom of the rock drop when I go off it, is getting punted. I don’t care if it’s a flipping “trail dog”, if it gets tangled in my front wheel or I go down because of it, I’ll sue the living day lights out of the owner AFTER I get the dog put down.
99% of the dogs out there have not been trained to behave properly around bikes, are not under voice control of the owner… They run ahead to other trail users and get in the way or take off after the wrong group then people have to stop their ride and figure out who the damn dog belongs to or, the worst one, the owner takes off and leaves his dog behind on the trail because it’s exhausted from running over rough terrain at top speed all day, so then when you come up behind it, it just trots along with its toingue hanging out and doesn’t yield or it just plain stops in the middle of the trail cause it’s delirious and dehydrated.
Show your damn dogs some respect and get them the training they need! Teach the to stop when you stop and teach them to stop OFF trail. Don’t let them run around and jump all over and bark and dig out rocks and holes from the middle of the trail…! And don’t just take off and ride like you’re in a damned enduro race, leaving your beast to try to hang on, sprinting full tilt behind you, running themselves into the ground. That’s not good for them, they aren’t designed for that.
Show some common sense and show some respect, if not for other users, then at least your animals!
Agreed. If people on this blog are so concerned about this couple, how about they follow the law and leash their dang dogs. If you are confronted after reading this blog and you have a trail dog- you are just provoking this couple with your own lawless inconsiderate behavior.
Two wrongs do not make a right. Leash your dog. Don’t confront people
without a dang good reason.
BLM states: Pets are allowed on public lands must be on a leash or otherwise controlled when in developed recreation sites. Pets should not create a hazard or nuisance for other visitors or harass wildlife.
Some people do have well trained dogs that follow verbal commands. BLM could have simply created a rule that said “All dogs on a leash” and left it at that. But they didn’t, they left room for other considerations. It’s not unleashed dogs that are a problem, it’s uncontrolled dogs. It sounds like you, most other people on this board referring to the “leash law”, and the couple in question don’t want to respect the other half of the rule.
We need a strict leash law, because many dog owners are unrealistic about Fido. Sometimes you need a bright line rule. The well-behaved dogs still trample salmon eggs and track in disease.
Wesen? I’m thinking either a Hässlich or Lebensauger.
It is obvious from the update to the main article that the same principle that applies to aggressive dogs (Animal Control won’t do anything until they’ve got multiple complaints) also needs to be applied to some people.
This is the same thuggish behavior some people use to justify their prejudice against youth in poor neighborhoods but it seems violent thuggery is ok if you’re white and old.
Wow, good thing it didn’t happen in Florida, the person who held up his bike at the gun toting kook could have been shot and killed. The kook could claim “stand your ground” because he was scared by the bike.
When did bikeportland become a dog bashing forum?
It’s not dogs being bashed, it’s the owners who ignore leash laws.
Well, dogs are being bashed peripherally as a function of their owners letting them off leash and dogs do what dogs do. Often this means trying to socialize with humans no matter what they are doing, sometimes this means attacking violently.
Fast moving bicycles and uncontrolled dogs are incompatible uses.
() If the park is going to be an off-leash-doggie-park then the whole area needs to be fenced off and bicycle activities banned inside.
() If bike recreational activities are going to be continued to be allowed then off leash pets needs to be banned. This will need to be policed by actual police not by vigilante old coots who could reasonably be expected to be diagnosed with dementia with violent anti-social disorder.
It almost seems that some people are condoning their behavior when it comes to dogs. An off leash dog(unless it is threatening) is no reason to show a gun or mace a dog. It may be annoying but unless your safety is at risk some of you need to chill out.
when a dog gets in your wheels of your mtn bike, it IS a safety risk
I have an acl injury from a biking accident 25 yrs ago, that will never heal fully
dogs have no business on mtn bike trails — go to the f*****ing dog park
If people are so pissed about off leash dogs why no hatred for off leash cats? Pooping in my son’s sand box, damn rodents
My cat just hates leaving his turf and venturing out to the trails or anywhere else he can’t reach under his own power.
Damn shame, too, ’cause the little guy sure can shred … the drapes.
Glad to read in the 3/12 update to this story, that CCSO has an open investigation into reports of incidents at the park. Word back soon from the sheriff’s office, hopefully will offer some answers.
First, I hope the police can make an arrest and bring charges on this couple. There is no excuse for using violent means to make a point. What they are doing could potentially lead to a death or serious injury. It seems odd that someone can threaten the life of another with a gun, and no arrest has been made.
Second, those who bring their dogs out to run off leash, despite it being against the rules, it’s potentially dangerous to the dog and other trail users. Simply, you are creating a conflict on the trail that doesn’t need to occur. Please don’t create a problem for other trail users. It’s not fair to your pet or others.
If you were a police officer, knowing what you know presently from news on bikeportland and comments about the incidents, would you arrest the couple? What would you be arresting them for? Do you know their side of the story?
Depending upon whether for certain the same people are connected to all the incidents reported as having wielded weapon spray, stun guns and firearms: If the investigation finds that the couple believes they didn’t initiate the incidents and we’re instead responding in their own defense, there may not be anything to arrest or charge them with.
Nobody having commented to this bikeportland story seems to personally know the couple of people suspected of the incidents. So far, people have theories and have drawn conclusions about the cause of the incidents, but nobody knows for a fact, why. Let the police do their investigation, and report publicly, what they’ve found.
There are a number of accounts from several different parties that have described the same two people and have similar descriptions of being assaulted in a similar way. Check the Oregon section of MTBR for a long history of this couple and their escapades.
wsbob, let me ask you this, pretend you are a child and are out in the woods with your family, having a good time, and someone threatens you and your family. Then they put a gun in your father’s face. Would you want these people to be arrested? This couple have committed assault.
There is real potential that this couple may escalate things, that they may make a mistake and pull the trigger next time or they are killed or injured themselves by someone that is carrying a weapon.
“… similar descriptions of being assaulted in a similar way. …” Fred
The conclusion of assault having occurred in the incidents, is based on only half the story, and on second hand information at that.
It doesn’t seem to matter to you, but I think a lot of people, including myself, would like the police to hear from the people being accused, so that with both sides of the story at hand, it can be determined whether they should be charged, and if so, what for.
If they’re guilty of assault, fine…charge them accordingly, but I hope you’re not expecting the justice system to, based just on rumors, go convicting people.
let me ask you this, pretend you are a child and are out in the woods with your family, having a good time, and a dog threatens you and your family.
I have more problems with stray dogs than I do with people — people seldom run at me full speed, barking and snarling and gnashing their teeth at me…. (in fact – never)
dogs do it all the time
My dad and I were the original builders of tnt and little monkey and we got maced over 4 or 5 years ago. This has been a big problem gor a long time.
Well…I for one am taking steps and have modified my downhill mt. bike to mitigate any problems I may have if I run into this couple http://www.nevadasurveyor.com/xBB2A0065.jpg
They walk almost every day to Sandy Ridge coming from Brightwood between 4-5 PM!
I have heard that photos of the people were sent to the sheriff, does anyone know if it is possible to see them anywhere? I for one would like to know what they look like for my own future safety.
The lady is petite & has longish brown hair I never really saw grey hair and the guy is tall, slender and usually wears a long coat, brown hat with a brim.
A woman maced a dog and the guy pulled out a gun? This is already is out of control.
Ok people complaining about dogs need to understand that if the dog is trained properly then there will be no issues. I used to ride with my dog and never once had issues with them being in the way. Honestly she was faster than most the guys we rode with. She never got in the way cause we taught her to know what’s around her.
wsbob:
“If the investigation finds that the couple believes they didn’t initiate the incidents and we’re instead responding in their own defense, there may not be anything to arrest or charge them with.”
You just wrote that if they are guilty of the Felony Assault with a Deadly Weapon, but are so delusional they think it’s self-defense, then they cannot be charged. You should rethink that logic.
fivefrud…unless you were present at or party to any of the reported incidents, you may not really know the reason the people felt the need to display or use their gear.
I suggested one possible scenario, but I’m not saying they should or shouldn’t be charged, because at present, at least to the public, there’s not enough to know one way or another, whether they should be charged. Hopefully you’ll think that logic through, and exercise similar restraint. If you’re interested, here’s a link to some relevant reading; note (2)(b):
http://www.oregonlaws.org/ors/166.220
If it turns out mental impairment is a contributing factor, that too could affect whether they’d be charged, and what for.
Of course mental impairment would affect how they are treated, but you hadn’t said that — you said if they felt they were acting In self defense, then they may not be able to charge them for anything. You can’t get out of felony assault with a deadly weapon charges entirely by simply claiming self-defense.
In your comment, here:
http://bikeportland.org/2014/03/11/sandy-ridge-trail-users-report-confrontations-with-mace-toting-couple-102611#comment-4578596
….It’s you that brought up mental impairment: “…but are so delusional…”. Fivefrud
And so far, associated with a vaguely described couple people in SR park, there’s been no proof that assault with a deadly weapon has taken place. Some people have reported a firearm was displayed and directed towards someone’s face, but the exact reason for that having happened is yet uncertain. That will factor into what and if they’ll be charged. Check into the statutes to find out what elements would have to be met for the actions to consist of assault. Thanks for reading.
Sandy Ridge kind of blows anyway. It is the land of the want-to-be fat guy with a 6″ of travel bike that can’t ride up hill. Baggy short wearing fools that stop 30 times on a bike ride. Worst than any dog is the guy that stops on the trail to rest during a bike ride. Enduro killed mountain biking
they’ve been arrested:
http://koin.com/2014/07/02/cantankerous-sandy-ridge-trail-couple-arrested/
“David Gathwright, 60, is charged with unlawful use of a weapon, menacing and pointing a firearm at another, with bail set at $50,000. Pamela Gathwright, 57, is charged with attempted harassment and attempted animal abuse, with bail set at $25,000.”
I had a bad dog experience at a beach where a dog charged me and snapped at me….
although it did not bite me, I did get mad and yell at the owner,
please leave your dogs at home — you people are the REAL terrorists…
I don’t want a broken neck mtn biking because YOU are too SELFISH to leave your dog at home — dogs make people fall off of bikes — its NOT cool
off leash dogs should just be shot – end of story
Off leash dogs who are in an off leash area should not be shot, and if you do shoot one you will likely be charged with a crime. I don’t like off leash dogs in on leash areas, but these people were calling dogs over and tasing them in an off leash park. It would be just like going into a dog park in Portland and tasing or shooting dogs that are in the off leash pen.
“…but these people were calling dogs over…” bjorn
bjorn…are you sure the Gathright’s were calling other people’s dogs to them, and then tasing them? The last most recent couple of Oregonian stories about the Sandy Ridge incident, reporting on the trial, said no such thing. The story did say, I believe it was Mrs Gathright…may have taken a step forward to taze a dog. She should not have have taken a step toward the dog, but instead, should have backed away.
oregon111…people should not be responding to off leash dogs by randomly shooting them, and you shouldn’t be advising anyone to do that. If a dog were to aggressively approach a person, with the likelihood of attacking them, that could be an occasion to shoot the dog. If the owner is present, calling the dog back may be more effective in stopping the attack. Lacking the presence of the owner, the person attacked may do better swinging a big stick, rather than pointing a gun at a dog.
According to KOIN and a daily mail article she was coaxing the dogs over with something in her hand, but then when they came over it was a taser.
‘The lady leaned down with something in her hand and the dogs were interested, but it was a stun gun and she was sparking it, trying to shock them,’ Angela told KOIN about a March 2013 encounter.
Other reports of her actually chaing after dogs trying to mace or tase them. She is an animal abuser not a victim bob. I know you like to play devil’s advocate bob, but these people don’t deserve defending, they are frightening criminals.
If they really were coaxing the dogs to come to them for the purpose of attacking the dogs, that would have been wrong. I haven’t heard the KOIN story or the Daily Mail story allegations.
Bjorn, I think it’s important to look at both sides of situations for the best chance of a fair and clear understanding of what happened and why. I’ve only read bikeportland and Oregonian stories about the Sandy Ridge incidents.
I have no reason not to trust the judge’s reasoning or opinion, though despite the fact she thought the Gathright’s actions weren’t justified, news stories about the incidents and the trial seem to have been very slim on details explaining what the couple did and why. Going on quotes in the Oregonian story, the Gathright’s may not have had very good representation.
Many more details may have given better insight in to just how ‘criminal’ this couple was. Apparently, this couple had, over years, hiked often at Sandy Ridge. Just how many incidents associated with this couple there was, is vague. One of the O stories made a statement that may have been reporting that the Gathrights had no prior convictions.
Just going on what I know from news stories about the incidents and trial, I’d agree that the Gathrights overreacted to situations they may have perceived to be a threat to them, but in reality, weren’t a threat sufficient to justify pulling out and using a tazer to ward off the threat, or a gun.
All in all, it was an unfortunate type of occurrence at Sandy Ridge, for which, long before the last straw, there should have been in place, better measures and procedures to keep small problems from escalating to the big one the encounters between the Gathrights and other park visitors became.
I had heard aboout them a number of times before this particular gun incident happened. You don’t mountain bike Bob so I can understand how you wouldn’t be in the know but a quick search of the sandy ridge mtn bike archives turns up many reports from people who had reported attacked by these people. One man called the sheriff twice in february of 2013 to report 2 incidents one in which they sprayed mace at his dog and one in which they came after him with a taser, the sheriff can’t find these records for some reason. There is also a note from february 27th 2014 where the woman maced a dog, they were followed home and the address given to the sheriff so it was definately them, that was the incident that resulted in the BLM saying they were persuing a criminal trespass against them, I am not sure if that happened separately from the other case. It took awhile to identify them and connect them to an address, but eventually they were found and that is what lead to the criminal case. This wasn’t a one time thing and the articles on bike portland have noted that bob. They didn’t overreact to a threat, they were the threat.
Bjorn…you wrote: “According to KOIN and a daily mail article she was coaxing the dogs over with something in her hand, but then when they came over it was a taser. …”
I know about the incidents reported in the news, prior to the one they finally were cited for…despite my not riding a mountain bike. I’ve read all the stories bikeportland published on the incident, as well as the Oregonian stories. The number and frequency of incidents over whatever length of time, whether months or years, was not reported in the news that I remember.
Information about how frequently the Gathrights hiked at Sandy Ridge was vague in the stories I read. A few people’s comments to bikeportland stories suggested they hiked there often…but that’s not very specific in terms of dates and time. They may in fact have hiked in this park for many hours and days over a number of years, with relatively few weapon wielding encounters. Unfortunately, whether this was the case or not, does not seem to have been reported in the news stories, and may not have been brought out in the couple’s trial either.
Don’t mistake the questions I’m posing, for an exoneration of whatever inappropriate actions the couple took. Knowing why people do the kind of things the Gathrights did, is important to knowing how to keep those types of things from happening in future.
I have live on Barlow Trail for 30 years and saw the Garthwright’s walk every day between 4PM-5 for about 3-6 years? When I was coming home from work I would see them on their way and my thoughts were admiration on their commitment to walking in this beautiful area. However when I retired I started walking my dog up the SRT road. I had just finished my walk and took my dog over to drink water and MS. Garthwright, who was quite a bit away started shouting and going out of her way, running towards me. I actually thought she was coming over to see my handsome yellow lab. When she got close, she turned into a very ugly person, threatening me & Leo with mace and her sidekick said, ” and I have a gun!” I was shocked! My very well disciplined dog and I just slowly walked away and to my car, which was close. Leo never reacted to her yelling and I decided to do the same since she was acting too crazy. In the news report it is stated that she is afraid of dogs. Would someone so afraid of dogs go out of their way and purposely confront dogs???? I am afraid of bears. I carry bear spray and I have seen a bear both on the trail & in my yard. No way do I go screaming and antagonize them so I can use my spray. I am very thankful I have never had to use the spray and bear & I both enjoy this beautiful area. But the Garthwright’s are crazy. They want to see animals/ & people hurt.
After my incident I reported to the police. They said they knew about this couple and had many complaints but until something happened their hands were tired. So I just stopped going there. Then several years later something did happen. Thank goodness no one got hurt. We should all send the Hess’s a Thank You for getting these crazies off the trail. It was not a easy ride but they did it. Thank you to the Hess’!
We all need good common sense and respect one another. Dogs need to be in control and so do people! AND remember we are only visiting these beautiful trails where wild animals eat, sleep,have babies, and depend on the forests for their survival.
Linda at: http://bikeportland.org/2014/03/11/sandy-ridge-trail-users-report-confrontations-with-mace-toting-couple-102611#comment-6340641
The judge in the Gathright’s trial, according to Oregonian story reports, did not find the couple to be “…crazy…”. People tend to use that word in common conversation to mean a variety of different things.
The judge apparently didn’t find the couple to be mentally ill or of a hard core criminal nature. No mention that the judge required the couple to undergo psychological evaluation to determine mental stability. No long term jail or prison sentences. She prohibited them from having weapons, and put them on probation for 5 years.
Oregon 111, you’ve missed the point. The Gathwright’s are crazy people. I commend The Hess’s for following thru and getting Gathwright’s convicted before a terrible accident happened: Not from dogs but from the Gathwight’s who were acting like MAD DOGS. Your comment on “Off leash dogs should just be shot_” Is uncalled for. Nothing “owns” the trail. You should always look out for anything that could be on the trail: dogs, people, bears, deer, etc, all share the trail. If you feel that way stay in the city and off the trails. This is a beautiful state for all to enjoy without threatening with guns because YOU had a minor problem with a dog. IT”S NOT COOL!!!!! Now hopefully we can all enjoy this beautiful Sandy Ridge Trail.
wsbob thank you for your correction. Thank goodness the judge didn’t go in the direction of mentally incompetent because then they couldn’t be convicted. Their behavior was inappropriate and a danger to the community. They were found guilty and sentenced on April 1. The news report stated that David G. was sentenced to 90 days in jail & 5 years of probation. Pamela G. was found guilty of 2nd degree animal abuse & sentenced with 5 years probation, community service , & ordered to take animal cruelty prevention class.
While I am relieved the Gathwright’s won’t be on the trail for now. I hope the Garthwrights will understand that how they behaved was wrong. If I was the judge I would have Ms. G do her community service @ the Guide Dog Center so she could see the wonderful work these amazing dogs perform. We all can learn from this and respect each other and this beautiful Mt. Hood area. It does not mean now that dog owners can disrespect others with dogs that do not know how to act on the trail.
Wishing everyone wonderful Mt. biking, walking, hiking while respecting each other & this beautiful place.
Happy Earth Day!
“…I hope the Garthwrights will understand that how they behaved was wrong. …” Linda
I also hope they understand this. People do have a right to defend themselves, relative to the level of threat present, if they feel threatened. What I gather from what I’ve read in news stories, is that while they apparently didn’t like certain things occurring at Sandy Ridge…in response to those things, they over-reacted.
I’m still not sure the reasons they over-reacted have been discovered, but maybe someone associating with them as a result of the trial and sentence will discover what that is, and help them work through it. Doesn’t make a lot of sense to me that people having a level of appreciation for nature that has them regularly going into natural woodlands for walks, would want to inflict pain and suffering on animals.
People with dogs do have a responsibility to control their dogs, especially in the presence of people that aren’t very comfortable with dogs. Control of dogs is something people often are overly casual about. A dog being friendly and gregarious, does not mean that every stranger they encounter is going to be delighted to have the dog approach them, bark at them, jump on them, etc.
It can be difficult and take time, but avoiding potentially bad encounters is a large part of what equipping dogs with basic dog obedience is about. The owner being able to have the dog return promptly to their side is very important. I don’t know what the situation at Sandy Ridge was or is, but some dog owners seem to have the idea that when they’re in ‘the woods’, the dog gets to do basically whatever it wants, as long as it doesn’t seem to the owner, that it’s being unfriendly or attacking someone.
By the way, I’ve already mentioned this in previous comment, but the Gathright’s may not be off the trails, though possibly those in Sandy Ridge. The Oregonian reported that they moved to Estacada. Lots of room for them to hike there.
While they may be allowed on other trails besides Sandy Ridge, their probation terms specifically prohibit them from having weapons. If anyone sees them in the next 5 years with a weapon please call the police immediately. These people weren’t defending themselves, they were repeatedly assaulting others for no reason, which is why they were both convicted, and David Gathwright is going to jail, not the Hess family. This isn’t about dog obedience, or inadequate leash laws, it is about a couple of people who can’t control their emotions pulling weapons on people on a regular basis.
“…they were repeatedly assaulting others for no reason, …” bjorn
According to what the Oregonian stories reported, the Gathrights did have a reason for taking the actions they did: they felt they were defending themselves. The judge just didn’t agree that the actions they felt they were taking to defend themselves, were appropriate for the circumstances.
At least some of the incidents the Gathrights were involved in, definitely had to do with the question of whether visitors to the park had their dogs under control. Apparently, some visitors to the park have not had their dogs under control, as noted by people other than the Gathrights, commenting to bikeportland stories. It seems the Gathrights experienced some of that, though there’s no report they were actually attacked by an out of control dog at the park.
The phrase “…regular basis…” can mean different things, depending on whose using it, to describe what. If there is a record of the frequency with which the Gathrights displayed and used their weapons in incidents at the park over the years they visited there, that could be referred to, to determine if they actually did pull weapons on people on a regular basis, or if it was more of an occasional thing. Sounds more like the latter.
Mr. Bob do you believe everything you read in The Oregonian? When I was young & naive I did. Since then in my life experiences of being interviewed in newspapers & actually having first hand witness to events, I know the newspapers & TV news reporters do not always get it right.
Did you read my first hand account W/ Ms. Pam? My dog was totally in control and by my side. Pam was quite a bit away as she purposely & screamingly confronted my dog & me. If she was afraid of dogs why would she go out of her way and try to excite my dog and start something? Fortunately me & my dog ignoring & going to my car, which was very close, stopped them for going further. That happened 5 or 6 years ago. There were many such threats happening before mine and after but the authorities didn’t get involved until it was reported Mr. G pulled out his gun. I live here Bob and on my way home from work I saw them every day between 4-5PM on foot or on their bikes going thru Brightwood and left on Barlow Trail rd. towards the SRT. That’s REGULAR!
Today I had a wonderful workout/walk up the SRT road with my dog. The riders were courteous and friendly. I no longer have to fear the Garthrights! That doesn’t mean I don’t carry protection, only now I anticipate a wonderful walk in Nature that feeds my soul. Before they were sentenced I stopped going to SRT because of The Garthwrongs!!!
This fall when I do my shroom gathering in Estacada I will be on extra high alert for The Garthwrongs. I am thinking of training my dog to be a truffle hunter.
These people may not be totally mentally ill but they are bullies bordering emotionally illness. This is where our justice system drops the ball. I hope the Garthwrongs can learn to appropriately control their behavior but who knows what their reasons are. It’s not their fear of dogs as I experienced. Their actions are no different to some people that get drunk and purposely start fights.
So perhaps all these years they were only threatening & as they got away with that, became more & more aggressive till they finally committed a true assault ( taking out their weapon). It is good day that they have left this side of the mountain and will be a great day if the Grathwrongs behave right no matter where they go/live.
Enjoy, Respect, & Love this Beautiful Place ~
Linda…I read your account of your experience with Mrs Gathright. If your account of her and your actions and your dogs is accurate, she over reacted, and she was wrong to do so. The judge apparently heard similar stories at the trial, and decided they were wrong.
That doesn’t change the fact that some of the people visiting the park, unlike yourself, apparently do not control their dogs. Perhaps not even when asked to do so by other visitors to the park. Just a theory, but experiencing that type of thing may have had something to do with the Gathrights deciding to prepare themselves for such occurrences.
Along the same line, I don’t know that the Gathrights were afraid of some of the dogs and their owners at Sandy Ridge, but it’s possible. And also possible that they got sick and tired of the nonsense, and decided to do something about it. In doing so, they over-reacted. Over the years they visited the park, had the Gathright’s been calling authorities about out of control dogs. Not mentioned in reports of the trial.
People have a right to defend themselves if they’re threatened. The Gathrights as a result of the judges decision, are forbidden to carry weapons, but they still have a right to defend themselves if threatened. I don’t doubt that if they are threatened, that they will defend themselves, though hopefully with more discretion than they have up to their arrest. I don’t think they’ll need weapons per se, to do it either.
That’s something for some dog owners to think about, who may, if they do a little self reflection, realize their control over their dog, and their consideration for other people not so comfortable with dogs, is a bit on the short side.
Reference to The Oregonian was simply to clarify that it and bikeportland were where I drew info from, about the incidents, rather than personally having been at the trial.
By the way, it really does no good, particularly in a public forum, to belittle the Gathrights by calling them names. It’s not a mature, responsible thing to do, and the result can sometimes worsen an already bad situation.
Why are you defending a now convicted criminal who pointed a gun at someone? Are you that mad over mountain biking that you’re jumping through these mental hoops to find these people reasonable?
If the dog is really a threat to you, and you cant reach a safe location you shoot it and deal with the cops later. You don’t stand around waving a stun gun around or pointing a gun at people.
Defending the Gathright’s. Not hardly. Why do you jump to the unrelated assumption that someone pointing out errors made that precipitated an unfortunate series of events, is a defense of someone that’s overreacted to a situation? That’s a big problem. As if some people with dogs at Sandy Ridge believe they can do no wrong.
No matter what, if you’re a mountain biker its your fault with WSBOB.
Despite what Zimmerman seems to want to think…in reading all the stories and comments to them about incidents at Sandy Ridge associated with the Gathrights and other visitors to the park, I didn’t get the impression that mountain bikes had much at all to do with the incidents that occurred.
Instead, the problems leading to the incidents appear to have been dogs, and that some of their owners failing to adequately control them. Maybe also, personal behavior of some of the people with dogs, was less than it should have been.
The Gathright’s over-reacted to some of that, and the judge found them at fault, accordingly. Given where they moved to, Estacada, even more woods and trails than at Sandy Ridge, most likely they’ll be out on the trails there, once Mr Gathright serves his three months. They won’t have weapons, at least not weapons by design, but if I was out hiking or biking somewhere there with a dog, I’d probably think it wise to keep the dog under good control.
Bob, while other names much worse come to mind regarding the Garthrights, which I would never put out on this forum: I shouldn’t have continued with what was first a typo/ Freudian slip, with their name. But being carded for my senior discount today and you indirectly calling me immature makes me feel young again.
But seriously let’s close this chapter on the Garthrights. They were judged and sentenced and now we all have the opportunity to go forward in working towards & continuing SRT as a wonderful place. Sandy Ridge is a beautiful jewel for mountain bikers. People who have dogs need to respect others & their dogs. Yes, we all have a right to defend ourself but let’s be level headed and appropriate in handling situations.
Beautiful place & Happy Trails ~
“…I shouldn’t have continued with what was first a typo/ Freudian slip, with their name. But being carded for my senior discount today and you indirectly calling me immature makes me feel young again. ….” Linda
Linda…’thank you’, and ‘you’re welcome!’. Nothing wrong with recognizing youth in oneself, still active. It just helps in some situations, to keep a bit of restraint on it. Congrats on having to be carded to convince someone you’re of age for the senior discount! Have fun out there at Sandy Ridge. I didn’t actually mean to say or imply you were immature, so hope you didn’t take offense.
That’s right that people with dogs have a need to be watchful of how their dogs behave in public, and I said before, especially around people that appear as though they may not be very comfortable with strange dogs, or that are fragile for one or another reasons.
Some people are absolutely great with their dogs: they have amazingly well disciplined, well behaved, happy dogs with great dispositions. Owners immediately bring these dogs directly to their side at the slightest hint of apprehension on the part of anyone present. Rarely a bad encounter occurs.
And then there’s the counterpart: dogs gamboling all over the place, rushing up to strangers, jumping up on them with their paws. Scares the heck out of some people. Actually hurts others, especially small of build people, or those that are weak.
It’s an effort to accomplish it, but dog obedience is a great tool for having dogs be great companions.
Again the problem was not the dogs, these people didn’t like that anyone else was out on “their trails” and they have had run ins where dogs were not present. When dogs were present the woman repeatedly called the dogs over to her or chased after dogs in order to attack them with stun guns and bear mace, when someone objected to her attacking their dogs without cause her husband pulled a gun on them. That is why they were both convicted and why he is going to jail.
Thank you for totally summarizing this whole event with the Garthwrights. I totally agree. It was never about badly behaved dogs. It was about badly behaved PEOPLE who put this community in danger.
For those people that have the time, use the SRT, and want to share ideas about ways to improve this wonderful place we should start a new forum.
It’s confusing, reading all these past comments & leads readers into thinking the Garthrights were on an honorable mission. Garthrights acted in criminal ways that could have ended in a tragedy. So glad the justice system worked & convicted them. There are other stories out there, not on this site, regarding their behavior w/ people when no dogs were present.
We all need to take note on how the Hess’s handled this difficult situation with good results not just for their family, but riding this long trail to the end, so it’s safer for the community in Brightwood & Sandy Ridge.
Thank you to the Hess Family.
Happy Trails ~~~~
People failing to control their dogs definitely is a problem. Not just at Sandy Ridge. That, and possibly, other people’s bad behavior, in addition to that of the Gathright’s, coalesced into the incidents at Sandy Ridge.
Your name handle ‘tired of the O’, is supposed to mean what? Guessing it has something to do with the Oregonian’s reporting. Yet it was that paper, and not bikeportland, that bothered to report on the Gathrights’ trial. It was the O that in its story, reported a small number of quotes from the judge, the Hesse’s, the prosecution, an attorney that apparently represented the Gathrights.
That story’s report seems to suggest that what happened to have Mr Gathright pull his gun, was Mr Hesse having raised his bike at the Gathright’s in response to her having brought her tazer out to taze the dog. Simply said, Mr G may have interpreted Hesse’s act as an escalation of the situation. A threat to him and his wife which he decided, justified his display of a lethal weapon. I believe, rightfully so, the judge decided that under the circumstances, display of a lethal weapon was not justified.
At Sandy Ridge, there were plenty of mistakes made, by all parties. Reading people’s comments about the incidents, I’m not sure people visiting that park, really have learned much from those incidents, about properly conducting themselves and their pets so as not to arouse anxiety, fear, and over-reaction on the part of other people in the park. Time will tell.
I read a lot of the comments on this article about the old farts who were threatening cyclists and dogs. One comment talked about what a cute old couple they were. After reading all these comments about the old couple I imagined they were maybe 80 years old. Nope…….57 & 60 per the KOIN article on their arrest. She doesn’t even have gray hair in the mug shot although it may be dyed. Must be a lot of REALLY young commenters above. Explains a lot of comments on BP – very little life experience.
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Someone said he usually wore a long coat. You can hide more than a handgun under a long coat. Not that you’d need more to confront dogs and cyclists.
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It does sound like they were a tad nuts; but who knows what happened to them on the trail to piss them off and get them started on their crusade against off-leash dogs. Perhaps an off-leash dog killed one of their pets. Hopefully they will learn a lesson and be able to live more peacefully in the future without going broke because of the arrest record, etc.
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Yes, off-leash dogs are a problem in any location – a lot of people are afraid of dogs – and a lot of people just don’t want dogs jumping up on them, attacking their pet which may be on a leash, etc, etc, etc………
Just to clarify:
“…Nobody has claimed they thought …”
…’they’, referring to people reading and commenting to this story and comments to it.
Doing a find on the word “claimed” has only turned up one reference on this page to this single comment. Not sure what you are quoting.