Photo: Dat Nguyen
32 year-old southeast Portland resident Scott Nowicki claims he was assaulted, when an employee of the Bike n Hike store on SE Grand refused to warranty a pair of rain pants. Here’s Nowicki’s story:
“I was just attacked by a shop employee at the Bike and Hike on Grand…I was attempting to warranty a pair of Endura waterproof pants that didn’t turn out to be very waterproof…Since I only wore them twice, they look fine on the outside. The employee Paul (he told me he was the manager) decided that I was asking too much of a pair of pants and wouldn’t warranty them. I of course, started to get irate that I spent $130 on a pair of pants that don’t do what a $20 pair does. Since I obviously wanted something he wasn’t about to give me, he decided to end the discussion.
Within 30 seconds it went from “You’re going to have to leave” to assault. He called for help, rushed me, hit me, then thought better of it, and then pushed and wrestled me to the door. So I called the cops, and am considering what to do next.”
When I followed up with Nowicki about the story, he said all he wanted was a “simple solution” to his problem but that “the guy was unreasonable and didn’t even try” to come up with one. Nowicki did say that this was the third pair of pants he had tried from the store. Nowicki alleges that when he asked to speak with the store owner (2007 Alice Award Winner Kevin Chudy), he says the store manager refused.
According to Nowicki, when it became clear he was not satisfied with the manager’s decision to not take back the pants, the manager became flustered.
“We were still arguing and I said, no, I won’t leave. I wanted to talk to the owner and asked the manager for a phone book. He said “we don’t have one”…but I saw it right next to him. Then he was on me…first he tried to grab my bag then he went for me and proceeded to fight and wrestle me out of the store.”
After the incident, Nowicki called the police and filed a report.
At this time, Nowicki is considering his next move,
“I don’t know…I mean, it’s a $130 pair of pants. I realize that’s an insignificant amount of money and it doesn’t seem reasonable to spend time and energy to take it to court. But I also feel like it’s not right to be physically assaulted by the store
ownermanager and have nothing come of it.”
Nowicki says he sustained no injuries from the incident.
store on Grand Ave.
File photo: 1/23/07
The story from Bike n Hike differs from Nowicki’s. I talked with store owner Kevin Chudy about the incident. Chudy says this is “an unfortunate situation” and that he stands by the statements he made in the police report, which claim that Nowicki has a “distorted view of what actually happened”.
The store stands behind its employee and claims that Nowicki was belligerent and that he threw the rain pants at the store manager and made threats. Since they have a zero tolerance policy on threats, they asked Nowicki to leave. When Nowicki didn’t leave, the manager removed him from the store.
Chudy was in the store at the time of the alleged assault but he did not see or hear the incident. So far there are no witnesses.
Bike n Hike has contacted their lawyer and I’m awaiting for a statement from them. I also hope to see the police report which should be available soon.
This incident is also being discussed on the Zoobomb Forum and on the Shift list.
Thanks for reading.
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You must be kidding? Rain pants? What kind of rider where’s rain pants!
I know Paul through a friend of a friend. **sentence deleted by editor**. He blew up at my friend unnecessarily during a disagreement one time. That’s about the extent of my info…
Rainpants thrown at staff. Threats made. Jonathan, thanks for rounding out the story as being discussed on the Shift list. There are always at least two sides to every story.
Should a store employee physically remove a customer from the store? Depends. If somebody walks into your private space, throws something at you and then threatens you, what are you going to do? A store is a private space. It’s somewhat suspicious that the store manager says this is the third pair of rain pants tried by the customer. What’s the history here?
I know Paul to be a very friendly, helpful, and positive guy. I have personal experience with Bike and Hike having excellent customer service–often providing service for free.
A blog is a wonderful thing for getting the word out–it’s a great town square. However, based on the discussion on the Shift list, it also allows for mob mentality to quickly set in. Patience everybody…
Scott, was this the third pair of rain pants you tried to return? Did you throw the pants at Paul? Did you threaten him?
Let’s get some facts before condemning a store that contributes significantly to the community and, by my experience and that of my son, offers wonderful customer service.
Indeed, every story has two sides. I’ve found that the truth often lies somewhere between. Employees can use force to physically remove trespassers. Is it a good idea? It all depends on the actual circumstances. And those of us who were not there will never know those for sure.
While this event took place at a bicycle store, I wonder if it merits the honor of an article on this superb site, as the gist seems to be a disgruntled customer story, not a bicycle story?
What can we gain?
It just seems that people can choose one side or the other to believe, and then debate it, and maybe anonymously defame the character of one side or the other, but never know for sure what really happened. Even the police report will probably simply detail the statements of the two involved parties and witnesses, and it sounds like there were none of the latter.
Though on the other hand, I guess we would want to know if there is a history of poor customer service, or a lot of unsatisfied customers at Bike and Hike.
They’ve always seemed friendly and reasonable when I’ve been in there.
Just some thoughts.
Give the fellas each a pair of boxing gloves and have them go at it.
This time of year $130.00 could prove more useful then rainpants…and if they were the third pair, what happened to the first two?
From my experience, if you wear something even once, most places can refuse exchange, and if the two times the pants were worn was in the rain, then they were certainly used. Why not complain to the manufacturer about their claim to be waterproof? I’ve learned that if a garment says waterpfoof AND breathable, it is one or the other but never both, despite the manufacturers claims.
As for the “assault”, time will tell. It’s unfortunate that the setting was a bike shop.
I have known Scott for several months and every time I have seen him he has been totally soft spoken, calm and reasonable… even in the middle of a heated race.
Does it matter if it was the 3rd time returning the pants? If they don’t work, they don’t work. If I had to return a pair of pants 3 times I would be pretty upset too. I might throw a pair of pants, hell I might even wear them.
I also wonder what threats they claim Scott made. Was it, “Im gonna kick your ass!” or “Im gonna tell people that you suck!”?
I have had some really good and also some rather poor interactions with employees there. And while I take Scott’s side on the matter I know it is easy to let ones emotions get ahold of you. The reason I am writing is because I feel a friend was wronged. I would gather that a friend of the other party would do the same.
I dont know if there is a reasonable conclusion to solve all this. Maybe if Scott and Kevin could deal with the ever nefarious pants than the healing could start.
I realize that the owner was not there and did not see what happened, and neither did I, but I have seen a lot of very negative things on some of the forums about bike and hike which I think are premature, and so I wanted to share my experience with the store.
When I was 12 I got hit by a car going 55 mph on highway 99 while I was riding to school. I broke 7 bones and spent 8 days in the hospital but somehow my bike managed to look worse than me afterwards. It was a total loss bent frame, taco’d wheels etc…the car probably ran over it.
The owner of bike and hike, who lived 90 miles away from me read about my accident in the paper. He called my parents up before I was even out of the hospital and quietly gave me a brand new bike because he had heard that mine was destroyed. (He specifically requested at the time that no big deal be made out of the gift) Who knows if I even would have gotten back on a bike if I hadn’t had one to ride around on right away. I don’t personally know the owner of bike and hike, in fact I never met him, but he is a big part of why I ride today, and in my experience he is someone who really cares about bike safety and getting people riding.
I hope that all the people who have jumped on the boycott bandwagon will chill out. Boycotts should always the last resort in a dispute when all other options for redress have been exhausted. Also owning a business in the US pretty much means getting sued so you can’t fault him for wondering if this guy who he doesn’t know is just looking to make a buck. Lets give this some time for the parties to work it out, hopefully without lawyers.
Bjorn
I wonder if all this is worth $130 to Bike N Hike. After contacting the lawyer it already cost him over $130. If you work in retail be it bike or not returns are a part of the job and owning a business. I like Bike N Hike and think they have some good stuff, I even got my mini from there but they need to right this or I just wont shop there. Hope they will…..
WTF: I guess you have never ridden in the rain for more than 32 seconds, or you weren’t going anywhere where you needed to be dry when you got there like commuting to work.
I have a 5 year old pair of Burley rain pants that still don’t leak. I have had cheap rain gear (much less than $130) that has didn’t leak. For brand new rain pants to leak they must be defective.
My question to Bike ‘n’ Hike: at what point did Scott become belligerent? If somebody comes into a shop pissed as hell about the *third* bad pair of rainpants, that’s too bad (there are indeed folks like this; I did retail for five years and there was hardly a day where someone didn’t come in to make a scene), but my guess is that they’re going to be used to it at that point, and willing to accept it isn’t the shop’s fault that somebody else’s product is defective, shoddy, whatever. Now, if Scott became pushy after getting refused his right to return defective merchandise (the features of which could only be properly evaluated *after* use)…well, it’s uncalled for, but that’s a bit different. In that case, you offer the guy store credit, insist he not go for pair #4, recommend a product that meets his needs and actually *works*, and explain you’re going to contact the manufacturer and find out what’s wrong to help figure out if the product is still worth carrying.
revphil:Why not complain to the manufacturer about their claim to be waterproof?
Indeed. My first course of action when buying defective bike gear from local retailers is to contact the manufacturer first and see what they think. I’ve actually had good success with several bike clothing/accessories manufacturers exchange the item for me by mail, sometimes even with assorted freebies to boot; this way, the retailer doesn’t have to worry about how the refund/credit touches their margins, and the manufacturer gets a chance to find out about possible production issues.
It’s true, lawyers are expensive.
And I personally think $130 is quite a bit of money.
I’d recommend that Scott call Resolutions Northwest, a non-profit community mediation organization. They’re website is at http://www.resolutionsnorthwest.org/.
Woah, woah, woah.
If anyone knows Scott, they know he’s a very reasonable person. Having worked in retail, I know there are nutjobs who like to return things every few months and screw stores, etc. Scott isn’t one of those people. If anything, he’s nice enough to get duped into buying a 3rd pair of defective rainpants before asking for a refund when they, like the others, were proven to be shit.
But let’s speak to the big issue, here. Who really cares about rainpants? Scott could’ve walked in screaming obscenities about Ghandi for all I care. The point here is that a Bike N’ Hike employee saw fit to hit and physically remove someone from their store FOR WORDS. Physical aggression for trying to return pants? Justified by the owner? How the hell can you folks defend that?
This is totally unacceptible. I can’t believe Kevin Chudy is standing behind his employee’s dumbass actions. No, this might not be blogworthy, but that doesn’t mean that it’s insignificant.
Just give ’em store credit for some pants that work. That’s all he wants. No need to kick his ass. No need to threaten to sue him for libel.
I want to believe that Bike N’ Hike is the good store I thought it was. This definitely puts a crimp in that.
I’d agree that there are two sides to the story, but regardless, the owner’s lopsided defense of his employee’s actions tells me that Bike and Hike is not a customer focused operation.
Given it was the 3rd pair of pants, there were probably a lot more civil ways to help a customer get pointed in the right direction of something that would work.
My instincts tell me that the shop employee was driven more by his ego than any sense of helpfulness.
I now think I know enough to never shop there again.
I bought some of those stupid shoe covers one time for $50.00 and they leaked like a siv, the zipper in the back kept creeping down and my shoes and socks never stayed completely dry. Finally tossed ’em aside and went to a pair of wool socks with a hole cut in the bottom for my cleats. Excellent fix. Didn’t think twice about trying to return them…let alone throw ’em in someones face. Rainpants? If you NEED to wear ’em…go to Freddies or Joes and get the yellow,light workers ones. Or better yet go to Goodwill.
From the beginning of Scott’s account:
“I of course, started to get irate…”
Who knows what that means? No one in this forum.
“Within 30 seconds it went from “You’re going to have to leave” to assault.”
Who knows what that means? No one in this forum.
This is a terrible forum for this story — if there is one at all. This is not about bikes. It’s about a dispute between two people in a retail store. I bet Paul’s friends would paint a similar picture of Paul that people here are painting of Scott. All this conversation will do will hurt people without any benefit of us knowing the facts.
Here’s something that some people involved in this discussion might want to read: http://www.wisegeek.com/what-is-defamation-of-character.htm
I agree with Slick—why is this even on here? Because of the possibility that someone who works at a bike shop in town may have a dangerously short temper, though we’re not really sure what happened? This doesn’t strike me as bike-related, and barely as news.
Yeah, what Chris said. This can really do nothing but cause harmful speculation on both sides. There are only a couple of people who really know what happened, and even they have very biased perspectives. Strange story.
I understand and somewhat agree with those of you who wonder why this story is on BikePortland. I decided to write it because it happened in a bike shop and involved some well known people and places in the community.
Also, once the story was in the Zoobomb Forum and on the Shift email list I thought it was something that should be dealt with on this site.
Believe me, I’m very aware at how tricky a forum like this can be for these types of situations. Because of that, I waited to publish the story until I had spoken to both parties and I tried to present the story in an objective manner in order to minimize any piling on either side that may occur.
thanks for your feedback…and now back to your regularly scheduled programming…
PoPo said, “Employees can use force to physically remove trespassers”
Could you please cite the statute?
It’s my understanding that if someone else lays hands on you without your permission, then that’s assault.
It seems to me the prudent and appropriate thing for the employee to do if the customer refused to leave would be to call the police and have him removed.
If I am in error, I’d really like to know. Thanks.
This story is beneath this blog.
Let’s get back to making promoting bikes and cycling.
thanks for the input brian… but I’d just like to remind everyone that “promoting bikes and cycling” is not the sole purpose of this blog.
I am not an advocacy organization. I present what I think are newsworthy issues and stories to a certain part of the community that happens to rides bicycles for fun and transportation.
Yeah. This definitely isn’t news.
Bikeportland readers don’t go to bike shops and I, for one, LIKE getting punched and shoved by retail clerks.
I was at the Gap the other day and I had to throw six pairs of Khakis at the fitting room lady before she even said anything, much less punched me. What kind of customer service is that?
Futhermore, I don’t even know this guy, so how can this possibly matter to me? Unless there’s video evidence with multiple camera angles, my instinct is not to believe this guy’s claim. He’s clearly an unreasonable, reactionary jerk about whom NOBODY in the bike community knows…aside from the fact that he’s an unreasonable, reactionary jerk. Maybe if he worked for a bike shop, I’d trust his account.
During my time in various retails jobs many years ago, I talked to many about reducing shrinkage (theft) in our stores and asked why would couldn’t physically detain anyone we suspected of stealing, or even if we witness said theft. This also applied to the guy that was screaming at the top of his lungs 2 inches away from my face for a disagreement in services provided.
Simply Put: Law suit prevention
If we needed to remove, detain, or otherwise use “force” on a customer in matters other than direct self defense, we couldn’t touch them.
But, that was in Michigan, I’m not certain about Oregon law on this matter.
It sounds to me like Scott is one of those hard to please customers. I know the quality of Endura clothing and the water proofness. I have to believe that Scott is wanting something out of a garment that may not be achievable. I have to wonder if its his own sweat/humidity thats causing his own unhappiness instead of a product failure. three pair of pants (including Enduras) and totally disatisfied… Then it sounds like he gets irate. people do get emotional when they dont get what they want and additionally when it comes to buyer’s remorse.
I do agree that $130 shouldnt seem like much to Bike N Hike to just take care of, but I also like their Zero Tolerance rule on threats.
I know some guys at Bike N Hike and they are reasonable fellas
The golden rule of retail is, “The customer is always right.”
What does that really mean? In the world of retail, the customer has more power than the seller. If the customer doesn’t get what he wants he will take his business elsewhere. Anyone working in retail must understand and accept the imbalance in power that exists in this buy-sell dynamic, and accept it. And anyone who can’t handle that should get the hell out of retail.
However, NO retail worker deserves to be treated in a threatening or menacing manner by a customer. A worker should have a reasonable expectation of safety on the job. The owner of a retail business has a right — and in fact, an obligation — to outline clear policy to reduce the level of genuine harrassment and threatening behavior his workers are exposed to on any given day.
In my opinion, anytime a customer behaves in an aggressive, threatening manner that cannot be diffused by the worker’s efforts and makes a worker feel unsafe, that customer should be asked to leave. If the customer refuses to leave and threatens the worker further, the police should be called rather than a shop employee trying to physically make the customer leave himself.
Retail workers are NOT therapists, doctors, or social workers; and it is not our job to treat sources of aggressive behavior. It is our job as retail workers to provide a specific set of products and/or services. We work hard to do so in as friendly and helpful a manner as possible, usually for low wages and few or no benefits.
Thankfully, the number of irate customers whose behavior escalates to that level are very few. In most cases, the shop can replace the defective item on a warranty basis, find the customer a more satisfactory product or simply refund the customer’s money; and that’s sufficient to resolve the situation.
The overwhelming majority of my customers are understanding, patient and friendly. They know how hard I work to make them happy and they often treat me appreciatively. They are friendly, funny and fascinating as hell; and they’re a big part of why I do what I do.
I’d certainly like to hear more about exactly why Scott found that the pants failed to meet his expectations.
It sounds as though this could have been a very easily resolvable situation.
Seems as though through a simple examination of the first two garments Scott used, the bike shop might have been able to determine a course of action that would have avoided a big problem.
Maybe the garment failed to meet its own performance claims through material failure. Maybe Scott’s level of perspiration exceeded the garments designed and claimed degree of breathability/waterproofness.
Waterproof is a relative thing. If it’s raining hard and you’re working out hard, nothing’s going to keep you very dry. Warmer than not having rain protection perhaps, but not dry.
Either you people can’t read or you’re insane. Read:
“Chudy was in the store at the time of the alleged assault but he did not see or hear the incident. So far their are no witnesses.”
You’ve been given a 1st hand account from Scott and yet folks seem to side with the account of the Alice award winning guy who “did not see or hear the incident.”
Because y’all seem more concerned about pants than physical aggression, here’s what Scott told me last night (Yes. I know him. Hear that Slick? Some bicyclists know eachother outside of the interwebs.):
1. He bought a pair of Enduras from Bike N Hike. They totally delaminated within a couple months. Bike N Hike was cool with getting him a new pair because those were clearly defective.
2. The next pair had similar problems with the seam tape. At that point, with two defective pairs of pants down the drain, neither Scott nor Bike N Hike thought that he should go for another pair. They suggested that he try the more expensive $130 model. So he paid the difference and got the fancier ones.
3. Within TWO DAYS of using them, the seams on the brand new pants were leaking. He’d get laughed at for having wet knees at work.
After three defective pairs of pants, he’s given up on Endura. He goes back hoping to get a different pair of pants or store credit.
BUT WHO CARES ABOUT THE PANTS?
Hi all,
Just to clarify things, at no point did I threaten anyone, and at no point did the pants leave the counter. I simply demanded that the pants go back to Endura, and then that I speak to the person responsible for the store. Paul refused, tried to chase me out of the store and became so outraged that I was going over his head, that he attacked me.
Finally, the only other witness is Paul, who will say anything to protect himself at this point.
Scott
What nonsense! What fun!
“The customer is always right” I can’t hear that one with out remembering a favorite quote from a Kevin Smith film. “The customer is always an a$$hole”. Seems to fit here as well.
I have worked in many retail establishments. The one I am in now would continue to pander to a customer like this for an eternity. My experience has shown that many people take advantage of that service. At the slightest hint of not getting their way they start to throw a temper tantrum errr, I mean “get irate”.
I have worked in other sectors of retail hell, in which we could toss whiny little b!tches like this out on their butt. Or heaven forbid tell them “No”. It is amazing to see how a normal looking, mild mannered person will completely flip out when being told no. It is like they have never heard the word before.
People use retail establishments and their employees for a myriad of reasons. The simplest of which, is to acquire goods either needed or wanted. Many, if not most people are there for therapy, either in addition to procuring goods/services or as the sole reason. They are paying for an experience and for an instant friend. They are also using the situation to empower themselves while demeaning another.
Customers like this want sycophantic suck-ups. They want polite and diminutive drones to pander to their sense of entitlement. And man oh man is it fun to refuse to play along!
I think Bike and Hike is a shoddy and low skilled bike shop. I never shop there. This story is enough to cause me to start frequenting their establishment. Good on them for sticking up for their staff!
Also did anyone miss the part where this guy was not injured? He was “punched”, “dragged out of the store”, “wrestled” and “assaulted”. Strange that he has no injuries, huh?
I will be sure to shed a solitary tear tonight for this jerk and his wet knees. Sheesh.
We have a witness!
Apparently Steve saw the whole thing 😛
“I was attempting to warranty a pair of Endura waterproof pants that didn’t turn out to be very waterproof…”
Attempting to warranty? This sounds like the language of someone that returns a lot of merchandise…
if something doesn’t work the way it should, you get your money back. i do at least. if you’re too much of a pushover to demand a refund when a product fails to meet it claims, that’s your own fault.
I posted earlier, but it never showed up..
Anyway, Waterproof pants are a myth.
They will always leak somewhere, and if they don’t leak, they will sweat inside enough to where they might as well just leak.
This is Oregon. You are going to get wet. Wear another pair of shorts, then change into pants before you work.
Too bad they wouldn’t warranty them a third time… But you should have never bought them the third time…. especially right after having failure in the same ones.
Too bad it went wrong at the counter…. They aren’t the nicest of people there generally, but mainly because they don’t want to help customer’s much really.
If a situation get’s out of hand, they have the right to throw you out. it is a private business, where I believe they could actually shoot you if they wanted…. if they felt threatened enough, just like in your own home… (I hate guns by the way).
Sounds like the two of you had too much testosterone going on, and there was a struggle.
The employee if it was my store would be fired, unless it turned out he was attacked first. But you would surely probably be kicked out too……
The real problem here is that this is posted on this site.
Since the actual circumstances here appear to be fuzzy, sounds like a good case for slander, your word against his, Business defending itself in a public order…blah blah blah…i hope you don’t get sued…
I would just invest in some really good fenders, quit imagining that you are going to stay dry,and drop it entirely…..
I have to agree with Brian, Dabby and others who question the presence of this story on this site.
It is so much hearsay at this point and does not really contribute in any way shape or form. It isn’t really news in the larger community sense and as the resonses here show, provides little more than fodder for pointless argument.
At this point no one knows. It’s gossip.
While it is at such an unformed stage let “Shift” and “Zoobomb” post it.
If the story took on more form, with witnesses or at least some larger context, then I think it would be worthy of this site.
Sell me defectice waterproof pants once, shame on you. Sell me defective waterproof pants twice, shame on me.
Live and learn, don’t set yourself up to get burned.
I agree with DK and Bill, and Jonathan for writing about this incident.
Wow I’m really shocked by the response by the greater bike community on this, nit-picking about the pants and the warranty and making assumptions about the person in question.
Bro tried to return some pants and got assault & battery by a supposedly do-gooder local bike shop and the action was backed up by the shop owner, and that’s NOT local bike news?
I’m not saying to knee-jerk support the bro on this one, obviously there are two sides, but even if the most gross exaggeration of both sides is taken there is still something VERY WRONG WITH ASSAULTING A CUSTOMER WHO TRIES VERBALLY RETURNING DEFECTIVE MERCHANDISE, THEN THREATENING TO SUE IF HE TELLS HIS STORY.
Essentially the shop STOLE $130 CASH from the bro by arbitrarily refusing to make good on their return policy because they didn’t feel like it that day because bro was being a little irate about the 3rd pair busting in 2 days time (understandably).
I’ve worked in customer service my whole life and when someone is pissed the first thing you do is SYMPATHIZE. You go, “I understand you’re frustrated, if I was in your position I would be upset to.” And immediately that de-fuses things. It’s called EMPATHY and the bike shop could care less about that, they seemed to only care about the BOTTOM LINE – which was keeping their $130 and to hell with anything else.
I think you missed the point entirely joshuadullman.
This was this obviously high maintenance customers 3rd time returning pants. I would say that shop had already bent over backwards for him and his outlandish expectations.
He had the first pair for months. He has said several times that the 3rd pair still looked new, as if they could re-sell used clothing. How wasteful can you get? He keeps using expensive gear, then trading it for something new. He was definately due to be cut off. When would it end? All that plastic crap just being thrown out. The shop was probably eating the cost as well. Disgusting, wasteful, and completely amazing anyone is defending him. especially people who supposedly work in retail. How can you have spent more than a month in retail and not smell this guys stink from a mile away?
He also was not “assaulted”. He is claiming he was assaulted, with no injuries to be reported. Your use of capitalizations, joshua, has just assaulted me and my tender sensibilities! Oh the humanity! Libel, slander, oh my!!
He was also causing a huge scene in the store. He was asked to leave and became combative, including throwing the pants at the store employee. He is lucky they did not call the police and have him arrested. A store is private property. If they tell you to leave, you leave. You do not stand there and continue to accost the employees like a spoiled 5 year old child.
In case you all missed it, this nutjob filed a police report, wasting taxpayer time and money. He is now flinging his fantastical tale of trauma free “assault” on every blog/message board he can. Encouraging letter writing and trying to get his preposterous tale into the local weekly rags as well.
He is obviously a scammer and out to either sue, or receive compensatory funds from Bike and Hike.
This site is far too good to be tarnished by this nonsense. What is next, a tale about how traumatized a cyclist is because the shop wont warranty their flat tire, cause the tubes shouldn’t ever wear out or be punctured?
This doofus is using the good will and open discourse provided by sites like this to further his petty grievances.
40 posts already, I guess we all enjoy gawking at the trainwreck,huh?
Oh and joshua, TYPING IN ALL CAPS MAKES YOU LOOK LIKE A TOATAL TOOL!
Thank you Steve. That was beautiful.
I would just like to offer that I have never known Paul or Kevin to not be extremely level-headed individuals, with much integrity especially in the context of their business environment. I know they are very committed to that “costumer is always right” mantra.
I am not privy to the actual circumstances naturally. However, Joshua’s story (I say story and not sober accounts of a situation) sounds sufficiently incomplete and strategically embellished. It has remarkably similar to the flow and structure of a child’s story when they are manipulating the accounts of an event to avoid and skew personal blame and accountability
I’m sorry I think a lot of people have jumped to conclusion based upon the the “fantastical tale”, shouted from every damn open forum that Joshua could get people to here and get riled up about.
jonathan, thank you for posting this story. i am happy to know what bike store i can avoid if i want to make extra sure that no employees attack me.
i don’t see why this is such a complicated issue and why people see fit to comment about such things as scott’s ability to pick out a pair of rain pants.
*that’t not even the point!*
also, i find it weird that when a friend of mine posted his opinion about paul (a person whom he has met) and his aggressive personality, jonathan chose to edit it out, while leaving all speculations about the kind of guy scott is (coming from total strangers) intact.
I suppose now would be a bad time to mention that throwing pants at someone is the same assault Scott is claiming happened to him. And it would probably be bad to point out that the claim is now that he didn’t get “irate” though the first statement regarding the incident of course used that term.
Honestly, this incident couldn’t be more petty if it tried. I thought it was odd to see here in the first place and I second the emotion that allowing someone to air their dirty laundry via this venue is disappointing.
This article was posted at a most fortuitous time as my wife and I have recently retired and are in the market for two fat tire bicycles to ride for exercise. Having read this account, we most certainly will not consider any Bike n Hike store since I won’t do business with any outfit that doesn’t deal fairly with customer complaints. I worked in retail for over 30 years and I know most manufacturers have a liberal return policy for their products, but of course it requires considerable documentation and handling to process these claims. It sounds to me as if the store manager was simply too lazy to perform his job responsibilities and risked losing a customer rather than do his job. Well, he’s lost our business, that’s for sure.
Oh sheesh! The sensationalism of this posting is bad enough, but the thread! The pissing contests between the various non-witnesses in the ol’ comments thread…now THAT is beneath the dignity of this now beloved site, yes.
With all due respect to both gentlemen, sh!t happens. Even the best of us loose our cool, and I am amazed at the rush to condemn either one or the other of these guys in this forum.
The real problem begins when a community rushes to judge a person. It happened to me in a different context once. Even though there were a dozen or so witnesses who backed up my side of events, my reputation from never recovered. I would hate to see this happen to either Scott or Paul. I think we should all take a chill pill on this one. Mob mentality can be very destructive to an individual.
Leat
Scott said:
Finally, the only other witness is Paul, who will say anything to protect himself at this point.
***
But somehow we’re just supposed to believe you?
Look, I worked in retail for about 6 years and still kind of do. In that time I learned as thats a big if) a customer ever threw a ppreviously quoted, “The customer is always an $!#%^!”. Also in that time, I met a few folks who worked in retail who had no business having any sort of customer oriented job.
So who do we believe here? In the absence of physical evidence, witnesses or video tape we should believe no one.
I’m kind of curious about the lack of witnesses. Bike n Hike isn’t that big of a store. The owner was there, it seems likely that there might have been some other customers or employees there too, and yet nobody saw or heard any either the argument that proceeded the fight or the fight itself? According to Scott’s police statements, Paul even yelled for help, and yet still nobody saw it… That all just seems very odd.
So let me get this right, some people feel this is below them, and they are compelled to let us know just how unfair it is that they have to read every comment on a story they don’t care about.
I want to say, dont feed the trolls… but it seems like that’s all thats left.
If you don’t feel for Scott I suppose that’s ok. But if you still consider yourself a reasonable person you might acknowledge we haven’t had anyone who is for Paul, the store employee, admit why they think its ok for him to hit Scott. For that matter we haven’t had Paul describe what did happen. So if it feels one sided that’s not Scott’s fault. I don’t know Paul, but I would like to hear his take on all this.
For the record I am confident that Scott was not injured because he is a really strong, tough mofo. And he is not a meathead, he is a really chill dude.
The defenses of Scott have been pretty well reasoned. The attacks on Scott have been mostly absurd (epically in the last 20 posts).
Steve, you are not making this better. Please stop the internerd hate.
Welcome to teh intranets, populated by assholes!!!
I can hear them chanting it now,
Jerry, jerry, jerry……