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  #11  
Old 09-19-2008, 01:08 PM
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Attornatus_Oregonensis Attornatus_Oregonensis is offline
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I don't think it's pessimism. It's basic deductive logic, because that's what has happened in the past and we can reasonably expect will happen in the future.
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  #12  
Old 09-19-2008, 01:54 PM
bikerinNE bikerinNE is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wrinkles View Post
Because this is a Portland Bike Forum, I generally assume that an incident reported here refers to the Portland metro area, unless stated otherwise. As it happens, this accident occurred in Bend, Oregon. The fact that it was posted by bikerinNE further suggested that we were talking about Portland. (Maybe s/he lives in NE Bend?)
Not to downplay the accident or any injuries incurred, but what is the point of this post other than to argue in a way that I don't comprehend that cops exert some sort of special privilege in such cases?
Does bikerinNE do a daily Google of 'bike hit'? 'cop cyclist hit'?', 'driver cited?', 'driver not cited', 'bicyclist cited''? Why? I don't really see the relevance of any of this unless it points to some local, dangerous trend that we might be able to address and correct.
I'm not a cop, just a bicycler who likes to stay informed about LOCAL issues.
wrinkles
Well being as such that the death of the suv driver was posted on the website here, i would think that such things matter where ever they happen.

But maybe you only care about your little world. Sorry, if it matters that much to you, don't read the post.

http://bikeportland.org/2008/08/13/m...ision-in-bend/

Last edited by bikerinNE; 09-19-2008 at 03:15 PM. Reason: removed insult
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  #13  
Old 09-19-2008, 03:53 PM
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beelnite beelnite is offline
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Smile Out of scope..

So anyone wanna talk about Le Tour?

Oh sorry... that's in France...
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  #14  
Old 09-19-2008, 10:58 PM
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bikerinNE, I'm not sure what you're trying to say in comment #12. In the incident for which you provided the link to the KTVZ story, it wasn't the SUV driver that was killed. The person killed in that August incident was the guy riding the bike, husband, father of two sons and cabinetmaker, Keith Moon.

Given that, in this discussion, the comparison made between these two separate incidents is considering in part that the person riding the bike in one of them was a cop, the point I'm going to raise probably isn't going to go over very big; also let me say in bringing this up, that I'm not suggesting the SUV driver in the August incident was not at fault, but please note this: In the August incident, the person riding the bike hit the SUV, not vice versa: "The damage to Stoery's Yukon tells the story. Moon hit the SUV on the rear of the passenger side, shattering the window." KTVZ, August 13, 2008

In the more recent incident, the driver of the car, Luann Lusk, hit the cop on the bike (his bike hung from the car license plate after the car stopped).

Last edited by wsbob; 09-21-2008 at 10:41 AM.
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  #15  
Old 09-20-2008, 12:51 PM
jami jami is offline
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Default mom always said "fair smells like pigs."

what poser said. the driver never, never, never gets cited this fast in bike-car collisions. sometimes it's "pending an investigation", but usually it's just accepted that whoopsie, "didn't see him."

maybe we all need to go to the police academy to earn our right to be protected from bad drivers.

but of course i'm glad the driver was cited, and i hope the cyclist is okay...?
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  #16  
Old 09-21-2008, 05:54 PM
bikerinNE bikerinNE is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wsbob View Post
bikerinNE, I'm not sure what you're trying to say in comment #12. In the incident for which you provided the link to the KTVZ story, it wasn't the SUV driver that was killed. The person killed in that August incident was the guy riding the bike, husband, father of two sons and cabinetmaker, Keith Moon.

Given that, in this discussion, the comparison made between these two separate incidents is considering in part that the person riding the bike in one of them was a cop, the point I'm going to raise probably isn't going to go over very big; also let me say in bringing this up, that I'm not suggesting the SUV driver in the August incident was not at fault, but please note this: In the August incident, the person riding the bike hit the SUV, not vice versa: "The damage to Stoery's Yukon tells the story. Moon hit the SUV on the rear of the passenger side, shattering the window." KTVZ, August 13, 2008

In the more recent incident, the driver of the car, Luann Lusk, hit the cop on the bike (his bike hung from the car license plate after the car stopped).
Well, what i was saying was the story posted on page 2 happened in Bend. What i gathered from the incident is the driver turned left, crossing a lane of traffic that was oncoming, and through a bicycle lane into a driveway, cutting the bicyclist off. Being that the bicycle was traveling with the direction of traffic, the SUV cut off the bicyclist. The driver turned left, through bicycle lane, not yielding the right of way to the bicyclist, as a result the bicyclist couldn't come to a stop or avoid the vehicle, the end result the bicyclist hit the passenger rear side and died. The driver failed to yield the right of way of oncoming traffic. No citation was issued.

In the story i linked to, a vehicle came to a stop at a T intersection, the bicyclist again had the right of way, the driver failed to see the bicyclist after stopping looking in both directions, and then continued hitting the bicyclist. Being the cyclist was a cop, the police were quick to point blame to the driver and issue a citation.

The point i was getting at in my comment number 12, was the Webmaster thought it was a news story worth posting on his website (SUV vs. Bike). 2 stories where both bicyclists were traveling according to the rules of the road. But one investigation lead to an immediate citation. Why? Why wasn't the driver of the SUV at fault, failing to yield the right of way to on coming traffic. Left turns "Yield to oncoming traffic"
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  #17  
Old 09-21-2008, 09:16 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by bikerinNE View Post
2 stories where both bicyclists were traveling according to the rules of the road. But one investigation lead to an immediate citation. Why? Why wasn't the driver of the SUV at fault, failing to yield the right of way to on coming traffic. Left turns "Yield to oncoming traffic"
bikerinne:

Why? I think it's because it's much harder to be certain for a fact that in the earlier August incident where the person riding the bike hit the right rear of the SUV, the driver of that SUV actually failed to yield. The person riding the bike isn't there to speak up for himself. What I've always heard, is that in general, the burden of responsibility for stopping for vehicles ahead lies with the driver, rider of vehicles behind.

The guy on the bike hit the SUV. Is that because the driver pulled in front of him so abruptly that he had not sufficient time to avoid a collision? Or for some reason, was the guy riding the bike and not paying attention to the SUV that pulled in front him, a lack of attention that caused the collision?

There's also this updated KTVZ story to the one linked to via your #12 comment:

Police: Bend SUV driver turned in front of cyclist

That story contains the following statement:

"The vehicle made a left turn into a parking lot in front of the bicyclist, causing the crash," said Sgt. Chris Carney. "He sustained severe head injuries which led to his death." KTVZ, Aug 13, 2008 05:03 PM

Also this one:

"As far as any citations or charges involving the driver, police are still investigating, but the Deschutes County District Attorney's Office will review the reports and make a decision." KTVZ, Aug 13, 2008 05:03 PM

I did a little search; went to the Bend PD website to see if I could find posted, the results of any further investigation into that collision. Unsuccessful. Also went to the Deschutes Co DA's website for info: also unsuccessful, though I did find this interesting link to a decision not to pursue charges against a motor vehicle driver involved in a collision with a guy by the name of Duane Noteboom, that was riding a bike. Seems like this collision was written about somewhere on bikeportland, but I couldn't locate it.

DA Announces Decision on Cyclist Incident

Last edited by wsbob; 09-21-2008 at 10:23 PM.
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  #18  
Old 09-21-2008, 11:21 PM
bikerinNE bikerinNE is offline
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Quote:
Originally Posted by wsbob View Post
I did a little search;]
Thank you for the research. I will always wonder though, because it's a police officer, did the police make there decision based on the Brother in Blue.

i posted the link cause i found it interesting. Sorry to "Wrinkles" if it wasn't "local" enough. But i find issues relating to our safety as bicyclists a huge issue. Being, as a resident of Portland, and a previous resident of Bend, and other cities, i follow all news stories. Any how... I wish the officer a quick recovery, and speedy return to work, as they have a hard job, that i respect.

Also to add, "Wrinkles" I was born and raised in Portland, as such, where i live, doesn't much matter, my home town will always be... Portland.

Last edited by bikerinNE; 09-21-2008 at 11:25 PM. Reason: to insert final touch for "Wrinkles"
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