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View Full Version : To the Frizzy, Dizzy, Blonde at 231st Ave!


Simple Nature
09-15-2011, 06:22 PM
Girl, you nearly mowed down another bicycle at about 4:00 pm on Thursday, 9-15-11, when you blew through the stop sign from the sidestreet Dogwood at breakneck speed onto southbound 231st Ave. It is people like you who give cycling such a bad rap. I'm sure you didn't hear me because you were fiddling with your buds! ...sigh...

wsbob
09-15-2011, 10:39 PM
Girl, you nearly mowed down another bicycle at about 4:00 pm on Thursday, 9-15-11, when you blew through the stop sign from the sidestreet Dogwood at breakneck speed onto southbound 231st Ave. It is people like you who give cycling such a bad rap. I'm sure you didn't hear me because you were fiddling with your buds! ...sigh...

On a bike? Hey there cowboy! That's a cue to pour on the coal, catch up with the gal and take advantage of the opportunity given, to issue an important mini-public service lecture on the inadvisability of riding as though they imagine there's only one oyster in the sea, and they're the pearl. Besides...well, y'know, now, because of the headline you used, a lot of us reading here would like to know whether or not this was a babe. 'Oh miss...I can't help but notice how beautiful you are, but how terrible it would be if, by not slowing and maybe stopping at the stop sign, you happened to absentmindedly ride over some little ol' lady, or smack into my big hulk passing through that intersection back there sometime'.

Also...probably ought to mention that some people reading here might consider descriptive words such as 'Frizzy', 'Dizzy', and 'Blonde' used together in reference to gals, as not necessary in a report about disregard for considerate and safe road use, and worse: inappropriately offensive and sexist. Still, it's kind of hard not to find the thread headline, well...funny!

Dovestrobe
09-16-2011, 11:25 AM
In my neighborhood one saturday I was heading down Nevada SW when this cyclist without looking for traffic veers out in front of me. I simply said, "Wow, I noticed that you didn't look when you entered this street, don't you have a stop sign?! No offense, I'm into defensive cycling, that's all." Yelling at an idiot just doesn't get one's ideas to sink in at all. When all cars go electric, I'm sure he'll change his safeless ways.

bobcycle
09-25-2011, 07:11 AM
"That's a cue to pour on the coal, catch up with the gal and take advantage of the opportunity given, to issue an important mini-public service lecture"

IMO This is not a good idea. Its somewhat similar to an automobile driver thinking if he just catches up with that driver that ran the red light (or stop sign) to lecture them they will change their behavior. At best the operator just made a mistake and will be embarrassed. At worst, they are not nice people and you will escalate the situation to a "road rage" involving weapons. In addition if you try to chase down every vehicle operator that disregards safety you are going to be one very busy person. Good luck with that.

"It is people like you who give cycling such a bad rap."

Again I am going to disagree. When I see one bad car driver I don't think it gives all car drivers a bad name. Neither should one "bad" cyclist give all cyclists a bad name. If it does, it is not the action of the individual but the erroneous thinking of the observer to generalize that is the problem.

1. The actions of one does not reflect on all. This is the basis of unfounded prejudice.
2. It is not our job to correct anyone (unless we are their parent or maybe close friend)

However I do think that forums like this one are great for venting steam when we see "inappropriate' behavior. :)

wsbob
09-25-2011, 09:25 AM
"That's a cue to pour on the coal, catch up with the gal and take advantage of the opportunity given, to issue an important mini-public service lecture"

IMO This is not a good idea. Its somewhat similar to an automobile driver thinking if he just catches up with that driver that ran the red light (or stop sign) to lecture them they will change their behavior. At best the operator just made a mistake and will be embarrassed. At worst, they are not nice people and you will escalate the situation to a "road rage" involving weapons. In addition if you try to chase down every vehicle operator that disregards safety you are going to be one very busy person. Good luck with that.

"It is people like you who give cycling such a bad rap."

Again I am going to disagree. When I see one bad car driver I don't think it gives all car drivers a bad name. Neither should one "bad" cyclist give all cyclists a bad name. If it does, it is not the action of the individual but the erroneous thinking of the observer to generalize that is the problem.

1. The actions of one does not reflect on all. This is the basis of unfounded prejudice.
2. It is not our job to correct anyone (unless we are their parent or maybe close friend)

However I do think that forums like this one are great for venting steam when we see "inappropriate' behavior. :)


bobcycle...I should explain I was trying to be amusing with the suggestion to catch up with the gal and give the mini-lecture. Just an excuse to get up closer to her and see what she's all about, not that some kind of suggestion about driving technique would even come into play in that kind of situation.


"...Again I am going to disagree. When I see one bad car driver I don't think it gives all car drivers a bad name. Neither should one "bad" cyclist give all cyclists a bad name. ..." bobcycle

I don't know that I'd say the problem with the occasional "...one "bad" cyclist...", is that it gives all cyclists a bad name. What I do think 'one bad cyclists' do, is singularly raise fear and anxiety, not to mention annoyance, amongst all road users in significantly inherent ways that 'one bad motorists' likely don't, or won't. This happens because 'one bad cyclists', being vulnerable road users, can much more easily be injured and killed than people in cars can. People that drive motor vehicles are afraid of this happening, and they being an involved party. I think this type of emotional response to the presence of people riding bikes in traffic is much more representative of people driving and traveling by motor vehicle than is the basic, primitive animosity on the part of some of the people driving motor vehicles, held towards people riding bikes in traffic.

Despite the 'I couldn't see them' rationale, lots of good, responsible, considerate road user motor vehicle drivers, logically are concerned about being in collision with a screw-up vulnerable road user person on a bike, and what that could mean to their life and even their future driving privileges. I can't be sure, but I think it's somewhat inevitable that after a few experiences with 'one bad cyclists', the sight of a person on the road riding a bike may prompt a fear-anxiety response; 'Is this person going to hold their line? Or are they suddenly going to pull out in front of me, leaving me without enough room to stop without hitting them first?'. That kind of thing.

Simple Nature
09-25-2011, 01:18 PM
...
1. The actions of one does not reflect on all. This is the basis of unfounded prejudice.
...

I'm going to assume you expect a response so I will. I specifically note the term "people like you" to include the actions of a specific group; those who blatantly ignore the rules of the road. And there are a lot of them on bikes as there are drivers of cars and motorcycles. I work very hard to keep a civil environment between cars and this particular cyclist (me). The kind of action noted here just seem to negate every effort I make to share the road in a respectful manner. Like the 1000's of instances where I would have loved to see a driver receive their just reward for disobeying the rules, this girl too deserves a steep fine for her ignorance or arrogance... whichever applies.

And as it happens, depending on the region, I find a higher percentage of bike riders breaking the law in one way or another than I do car drivers. This really is significant. It makes me less safe when riding.

bobcycle
09-26-2011, 05:01 PM
"And as it happens, depending on the region, I find a higher percentage of bike riders breaking the law in one way or another than I do car drivers. This really is significant. It makes me less safe when riding."

Often when on the freeway I see significant amount of drivers (most?) driving over the speed limit. Far more than I see cyclists running red lights. Changing lanes without signaling also has a lot of offenders. Cars that "roll" the stop sign by my house has to be at least 50% maybe higher. Right turn on red without stopping another high percentage of law breakers. And through all that I don't conclude that most auto drivers are law breakers. Many cyclists roll stop signs, most obey speed limits, most try to stay to the far right where practical. My conclusions are different than yours. I think the percentage of cyclists breaking the law is no higher than the percentage of auto drivers. Not very scientific I know, just observations seen through my own biases. :)

wsbob
09-26-2011, 07:36 PM
"And as it happens, depending on the region, I find a higher percentage of bike riders breaking the law in one way or another than I do car drivers. This really is significant. It makes me less safe when riding."

Often when on the freeway I see significant amount of drivers (most?) driving over the speed limit. Far more than I see cyclists running red lights. Changing lanes without signaling also has a lot of offenders. Cars that "roll" the stop sign by my house has to be at least 50% maybe higher. Right turn on red without stopping another high percentage of law breakers. And through all that I don't conclude that most auto drivers are law breakers. Many cyclists roll stop signs, most obey speed limits, most try to stay to the far right where practical. My conclusions are different than yours. I think the percentage of cyclists breaking the law is no higher than the percentage of auto drivers. Not very scientific I know, just observations seen through my own biases. :)


Reading his comments, I don't see him suggesting that, as you seem to conclude he has...(I'm paraphrasing your words), "...that most people on bikes are law breakers. ...".

What he said was: "...depending on the region, I find a higher percentage of bike riders breaking the law in one way or another than I do car drivers."

Percentage, depending on the region. Ladd's Addition is one example of this that editor/publisher maus has given lots of attention on the bikeportland front page. Some years back, one of the tv stations sent a crew out to film road users approaching and entering the traffic circle, past the stop signs. Counts for people on bikes failing to stop to any degree for the stop signs, was higher than for people driving cars.

How many people driving motor vehicles pass by your house during the day? How many people on bikes? Of those from each group, which has the greater percentage that don't at least slow to a walking speed...3.5mph as they roll the stop signs?