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PDXfly
10-22-2007, 11:37 PM
Has anyone else been refused service at a dive-through at any local food establishments because they were on a bicycle? I was last night: They didn't seem to have a problem taking my order, but when I got to the window I was told they wouldn't serve me because I on a bicycle. I asked the employee if they served motorcycles, they didn't care to give me an answer. What do you think, discrimination, or maybe they have an adequate reason for not severing cyclists through the drive-through?
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donnambr
10-23-2007, 12:13 AM
The Burgerville on Hawthorne won't serve me through the drive-through. Given that so many places seem to use the same line, I think it has something to do with their liability insurance. That is, they have the company policies they do because their insurer tells them they must if they are to keep their insurance.

toddistic
10-23-2007, 12:51 AM
the real question is: why are you eatting fast food? that stuff is terrible. :)

wsbob
10-23-2007, 12:55 AM
I actually had such an experience quite a few years ago at one of the fastfood joints on W Burnside...I can't remember if it was McDonalds, or Taco Bell, etc.

When they wouldn't serve me, I asked them why. I can't remember their exact words, but remember the rationale being security related. Something about the idea that a person not enclosed in a vehicle would be a situation more conducive to a person with criminal intent. Made very little sense to me. I was hungry and they wouldn't feed me.

nishiki
10-23-2007, 08:57 AM
Has anyone else been refused service at a dive-through at any local food establishments because they were on a bicycle? I was last night: They didn't seem to have a problem taking my order, but when I got to the window I was told they wouldn't serve me because I on a bicycle. I asked the employee if they served motorcycles, they didn't care to give me an answer. What do you think, discrimination, or maybe they have a adequate reason for not severing cyclists through the drive-through?

Same issue was raised about a year ago.

1- It's called a DRIVE through --> Get it?
2- They won't serve you for liability reason. If some cager hits you from behind, you could claim the restaurant as partly responsible.
3- What's worse than getting service from a fast food is eating its food.

Bjorn
10-23-2007, 09:28 AM
Jonathan wrote an article about this when I brought it up to him just after moving to town. All drive thru's in Corvallis serve cyclists so I was pretty shocked when I went to grab some jack in the box on sandy while riding home one night (it was so late that most places were closed and I was hungry). They took my order and then when I got to the window they wouldn't give it to me, the guy actually threw the food away rather than selling it to me.

I think that discussing whether or not we should be eating fast food misses the whole point. Other places are sometimes open only via drivethru, like banks. I don't buy the liability as a valid reason since Corvallis doesn't have this issue. It doesn't seem like it should be legal for a business to have car ownership as a prerequisite for being a customer.


Bjorn

mtmann
10-23-2007, 10:15 AM
the real question is: why are you eatting fast food? that stuff is terrible. :)

I generally agree, but as long as Burgerville makes their sweet potato fries, i just can't join in a total condemnation.

zeldabee
10-23-2007, 10:26 AM
I've encountered the service refusal at the drive-thru phenomenon before, and it's infuriating. I've been told it's a liability issue, and I have a hard time seeing it. If a driver rear ended me on my bike in a drive through, I'd hold the driver responsible.

If you've gotta eat fast food, Burgerville is pretty good. If I ever tried to go through a Burgerville drive-thru and was refused service, it would make me so mad I wouldn't want to give Burgerville any more of my business. This would make me sad, since Burgerville is my one fast-food indulgence, and I would miss it terribly. So, I won't risk it by attempting it. (On some level, that makes sense...trust me.)

Haven_kd7yct
10-23-2007, 10:52 AM
Actually, most fast food places I've seen have posted a sign that says they won't serve walk-ups in the drive through.

I think it has more to do with the security of the employees than the liability of you getting rear-ended in the drive-through line.

I saw a news report last year about a man in a car in a drive-up line who was stabbed by two guys who walked up.

I don't agree with the policy, though; if I ride my bike up to the window, I want my food. :) However, if they won't give it to me in the drive through, I'll walk my bike into the restaurant and pay for it there. :)

And yeah: Sweet potato fries, and Walla Walla sweet onion rings. Yummy!

geoff
10-23-2007, 11:35 AM
I rarely eat fast food, but i think this policy is absurd. We should organize a ride that goes through drive throughs. If we got a mass of riders to order one at a time, I think the fast food joints would rethink this ridiculousness.

OnTheRoad
10-23-2007, 12:39 PM
The JackInTheBox on SE Powell near the Ross Island Bridge prohibits not only bicycles and pedestrians but SCOOTERS.

I had used the Bank of America on SE 6th and Morrison drivethrough for 6-7 years. The assistant manager had even looked up BofA policy and learned that it was up to the individual branch to allow or prohibit. There was no problem with me using the drive-thru UNTIL a new manager started working there about six months ago.

While this issue is not a major one, it would be nice if the City Council would address it.

wsbob
10-23-2007, 10:39 PM
In fact, on the 11:00 "news" recently, I seem to remember one of those 7 second video filler items where some thief actually tried to jump through the drive-in window to get money. Or maybe they just wouldn't give him his food?

Bjorn
10-24-2007, 03:12 PM
Haven,

I agree that it would be no big deal most of the time to go inside, except that it is a trend for places with drive thrus to have separate hours where they are only open at the drive thru. So they aren't actually making it inconveinent they are actually refusing any service.

Also I don't think that refusing walk ups really makes employees safer, anyone can walk up and rob a drive thru even if they normally wouldn't serve walk ups.

Bjorn

jami
10-24-2007, 03:17 PM
burger king at east end of hawthorne bridge. i don't eat a lot of fast food, but it was late, and i was staaarving. and they turned me away. i'll never be back using any mode of transportation.

PDXfly
10-24-2007, 04:24 PM
it would be nice if the City Council would address it.



How would we go about it getting them to address it?
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jdubble
10-24-2007, 10:14 PM
I was refused service at the Burgerville on Hawthorne this summer. I went in and talked to the manager-on-duty, who apologized and said he didn't make the rule, but that it had to do with security, that it's easier for someone to reach in and grab an employee. Whatever. I did want to ask if they served motorcycles, who would be even higher up and be able to make an even faster get-away, but I was distracted by having to wrangle my tired and hungry 4 and 1 year old boys. It sure would've been easier to keep them in the trailer, get our food quickly and get them home.

The ironic thing at Burgerville is that the drive-thru windows are plastered in stickers that say "DRIVE LESS, SAVE MORE". I wanted to write their corporate office and ask them how they can participate that campaign (http://www.drivelesssavemore.com/index.php) and still refuse to serve bikes in the drive-thru, but never got around to it while I was still annoyed enough to do something about it.

Klixi
10-25-2007, 10:57 AM
This also happened to me once when nothing else was open and I was STARVING. In my desperation I asked for the name of the guy working the drive thru (he gave it to me), then said I was a writer for WW and would be very interesting in doing a piece on the situation and asked for his managers name and when a good time I could come back to get an interview was. I was very cordial and polite about it all.. I have NO idea why I played this angle, but it worked! I laughed the entire ride home. Then ate ;) Everyone is terrified of being the Rogue...

manao
10-25-2007, 11:45 AM
To counter the drive-through discrimination, a new cafe on North Lombard offers a bike-through window, and it even offers a cyclist discount. Check it: www.littleredbikecafe.com

Haven_kd7yct
10-25-2007, 12:24 PM
Bjorn, you are correct; and I didn't take that into account when I wrote my post! :)

I don't have experience with biking through the drive-through that late at night, so I couldn't comment knowledgeably on it. This is quite informative, though, in case I find myself out and about and hungry. :)

Jakelin
10-26-2007, 11:56 AM
I saw a news piece on this years ago and like a few others have said it all comes down to problems that restaraunts have had in the past with people on foot reaching in the window and taking cash, grabbing employees and in general behaving erratically. Someone in a car is not as mobile as quickly, nor able to easily get out of their car when they are up at the window (as you know from when someone drops some of your cash out of their hand and onto the ground as they give it to you).

Unfortunatly I don't think that any amount of complaining is going to get these companies to reverse a policy they put in place to to protect their money and their employees. You can thank dumbass thieves for the inconvenience they cause to good people.

huss
10-29-2007, 03:29 AM
Stage a ride and visit 3 or 4 fast food places, with about 20 riders all taking turns and ordering then riding up to the drive thru, after the third or fourth customer in a row the manager might start to freek out about all the food being thrown in the trash.

If Corvallis can do this why cant Portland?
Up on(near) Broadway you could hit Wendys, Mickie D's, Taco-Bell and KFC.

This would most defentily need to be filmed!!! I work nighs, would love to be a part of this.......might not fit into my schedule, then again luch time would be good also, but after 4-5 dinner time lots of people trying to go thru in cars....next critical MASS?:cool:

Ringer
10-29-2007, 07:47 AM
Popeyes on MLK near Freemont has served me on bike. They really do do chicken right.

jwdoom
10-31-2007, 08:52 PM
This would most defentily need to be filmed!!! I work nighs, would love to be a part of this.......might not fit into my schedule, then again luch time would be good also, but after 4-5 dinner time lots of people trying to go thru in cars....next critical MASS?:cool:

No, not cool. These places are private businesses and if they don't want to serve bikes in the DRIVE THRU, they're not obligated to. Quit crying about it.

nishiki
11-01-2007, 12:33 PM
No, not cool. These places are private businesses and if they don't want to serve bikes in the DRIVE THRU, they're not obligated to. Quit crying about it.

+1

a d

huss
11-01-2007, 01:31 PM
Hey its just I idea to bring to there attention that bikers get hungry, even late at nite when the dinning room is closed. And when I want to travel light IE no lock it might be cool to ride up and be able to get food. I ran into this years ago and havent tried since. Even plaid pantry is good most of the time, bring my bike in and set by the ice cream cooler or something. Bussiness should be open to accomodate bikers more.

Anyway it would be cool to do it if you wanted to....Late nite after drinken, maybe hungry 4th meal. Anyway ride safe.:cool:

nishiki
11-01-2007, 04:09 PM
Hey its just I idea to bring to there attention that bikers get hungry, even late at nite when the dinning room is closed. And when I want to travel light IE no lock it might be cool to ride up and be able to get food. I ran into this years ago and havent tried since. Even plaid pantry is good most of the time, bring my bike in and set by the ice cream cooler or something. Bussiness should be open to accomodate bikers more.

Anyway it would be cool to do it if you wanted to....Late nite after drinken, maybe hungry 4th meal. Anyway ride safe.:cool:

Yeah, well sounds like you got some growing up to do.

tvhwy
11-01-2007, 04:38 PM
No, not cool. These places are private businesses and if they don't want to serve bikes in the DRIVE THRU, they're not obligated to. Quit crying about it.

They are not legally obligated to serve cyclists. Should they be? Why or why not?

Scott Mizee
06-07-2008, 06:17 AM
I have had two experiences with taking the bakfiets through the fast food "drive through" window. Both were at McDonalds.

The first one was about a year ago at McDonalds in St. Johns. There was an adamant woman working the window who basically yelled at my kids and I that they wouldn't serve us because their insurance did not allow us to mix with motor vehicles in that area of the parking lot. I was upset enough to speak to the manager and he offered us to come back again for free ice cream later.

The second experience was two nights ago. I had my 7, 4 and 2 year olds in the front of the bakfiets and we navigated the McDonald's drive through in the Rose Quarter. I was a little nervous given my past experience, but really didn't want to have to unbuckle all the kids and chase them around the inside of the restaurant. I'm happy to say that other than the strange looks this time, our stomachs were filled happily with our post little league treat. Everyone was happy for the long ride home back to University Park.

djasonpenney
06-07-2008, 08:15 AM
I've had very positive experiences going through Starbucks, Rite-Aid, Washington Mutual, and other dive-through (sorry, couldn't resist) businesses here in Washington County,

Gawd, Portland is a great place to live!

BTW, anyone ever thought of cashing someone's check at a bank drive through, and then, when they decline to cash it, taking to writer to small claims since the bank wouldn't cash their check? That would be...entertaining since the check writer would have to subsequently file a tort against their bank for the legal charges....

jr98664
06-09-2008, 05:10 PM
Up at a Burgerville in the Fisher's Landing area in Vancouver, I have been told once or twice that they can't serve me in the drive through. I'm surprised that all of you have been able to place an order in the first place. It would seem that the drive through never even picks me up when I am sitting there ready to order.

How exactly do they tell when a car is there? If it's a scale or induction loop, it seems perfectly reasonable that a bike might not trip the sensors.

fredlf
06-10-2008, 10:53 AM
Years ago, a friend and I were refused service trying to pedal through a Jack-in-the-box. Same BS about safety and liability. Since we only lived about two blocks away, we rode home and got the (non-functioning) car. Pushed the car down the street and then pushed it through the drive-through. We pushed it up to the window and got in. Once we had our food we got out and pushed it back down the street to home. The manager was pissed but their rules didn't say the car had to be running!

wsbob
06-10-2008, 11:20 AM
That's too much! A frat boy prank for sure. You could have just walked into the joint and got your food. I wish I could film something like that. Imagine having to be the manager of a crazy place like that, having to deal with all the related nonsense. Just the smell of the meat cooking would drive me far, far away.

fredlf
06-10-2008, 03:05 PM
Actually, the most ridiculous thing is we had walked there planning to go inside, but they said only the drive-thru was open. BTW, I'm not sure the stuff they cook there is actually meat.

jr98664
06-15-2008, 02:51 AM
I was on my way home from a nice 50-mile-long ride around the outskirts of Vancouver, and I was hungry for some Burgerville. Unfortunately, it was almost eleven at night and only the drive-through was open. While my bike didn't trip the sensor for me to order, they gladly took my order at the window and had my food in no time.

I was planning to have to tell them that I would just take my money elsewhere, but I was pleasantly surprised.

EthanPDX
07-06-2008, 08:53 AM
The drive-thru bans are very vexing. I have been given so many bizarre rationales, and I am always amazed that the policy is often not consistent between different locations of the same business.

What is really needed is a city ordinance that makes serving human powered vehicles mandatory. Portland's city government has seemingly been behind the push towards Platinum . . . even to the point of investing money into various infrastructure products. I am not sure what the cost of passing a drive-thru law would be, in practical terms, but I would suspect it's much less that a bike traffic signal or other physical improvement.

Given that the City wants to facilitate people not using cars for short trips (which in the case of the streetcar expansion will cost many millions of dollars) it seems like a small but meaningful gesture for the city to make more destinations usable and convenient for cyclists.

Scott Mizee
07-06-2008, 07:05 PM
EthanPDX:

That seems like such a logical 'next step,' it's almost as if to say, "Why hasn't this been done already?"

Perhaps there is someone on here who knows more about what is involved for a new city ordinance? I would think that an ordinance such as this would not be burdensome to our small (or large) business owners provided it does not change their insurance costs, etc.

Jonathan? perhaps a story about this subject for a larger community discussion?

-Scott

wsbob
07-06-2008, 09:15 PM
I suspect that anyone can propose, write and submit an ordinance to city council, but for it to be passed and made law, it would have to address the concerns of people affected by what it prescribes. And, the city attorney would have to study and approve it. I'll bet someone in a group like the BTA knows all about how to do this.

EthanPDX
07-15-2008, 09:26 PM
Is there a Bricker in the house?

mizake
07-16-2008, 09:09 AM
late night urge for taco bell on the way home last night. the doors were locked so i went to the drive through and....

"two baja chalupas please."
"sir, i ain't even gonna serve you on a bike."
"damn."

i go home hungry, but my stomach is in good shape this morning.

toddistic
07-16-2008, 09:39 AM
late night urge for taco bell on the way home last night. the doors were locked so i went to the drive through and....

"two baja chalupas please."
"sir, i ain't even gonna serve you on a bike."
"damn."

i go home hungry, but my stomach is in good shape this morning.

im more of a crunch wrap supreme guy myself

jr98664
07-16-2008, 12:54 PM
late night urge for taco bell on the way home last night. the doors were locked so i went to the drive through and....

"two baja chalupas please."
"sir, i ain't even gonna serve you on a bike."
"damn."

i go home hungry, but my stomach is in good shape this morning.

Did you mention to him the fact that you could not be served from the dining room because it was closed? Considering the fact that he is refusing to serve you simply because you are on a bike, doesn't that at least count for a slight bit of discrimination against cyclists? What would happen if he refused to serve all people that came in trucks, with red hair or large tattoos, or something absurd like that?

Would we be able to sue such a company based on grounds of discrimination? Any ideas, Ray Thomas?

mizake
07-16-2008, 03:50 PM
Did you mention to him the fact that you could not be served from the dining room because it was closed? Considering the fact that he is refusing to serve you simply because you are on a bike, doesn't that at least count for a slight bit of discrimination against cyclists? What would happen if he refused to serve all people that came in trucks, with red hair or large tattoos, or something absurd like that?

Would we be able to sue such a company based on grounds of discrimination? Any ideas, Ray Thomas?

I'm not about to argue with some lady in a drive-through window regarding some directive given to her by the manager who may or not be on the premises and who is likely following a corporate directive and honestly, I'm not going to fight that hard for Chalupas. I've tried in the past to have some kind of dialogue with the Taco Bell drive-through person and their supervisor, but they usually just tell me they're going to call 911 and shut the drive-through window and show me a phone and a threatening pointer finger, quivering with authoritative anticipation.

But if you want to fight for your right to be served a Big Mac on your bike, I fully support you hehe =D

Bjorn
11-22-2008, 12:28 AM
I just happened to bike through moto pizza on 82nd tonight and they were super welcoming... the pizza is cheap, and cheaply made, but the service is great and they thought it was great I was biking through so I recommend them.

Bjorn

Jauna
11-24-2008, 11:07 AM
They let me pick up prescriptions at the Walgreens on Ainsworth and MLK at the drive thru. It was great since I had forgotten my lock that day.

OnTheRoad
11-24-2008, 03:15 PM
A while back I noticed at the Jack-In-A-Box at about SE 8th and Powell that they not only prohibit bicycles from the drive-thru lane but also scooters.

Motorcycles apparently are OK.

If safety is the stated issue, why are motorcycles OK and motor scooters not?

It seems maybe the vehicle size footprint is driving the rules.

Duncan
11-25-2008, 08:22 AM
A while back I noticed at the Jack-In-A-Box at about SE 8th and Powell that they not only prohibit bicycles from the drive-thru lane but also scooters.

Motorcycles apparently are OK.

If safety is the stated issue, why are motorcycles OK and motor scooters not?

It seems maybe the vehicle size footprint is driving the rules.


Maybe they don't like the smell of two-strokes?:D

phdbd
11-28-2008, 05:08 PM
I remember stopping at the Bell on Interstate one night a couple months back I'd already eaten a couple of donuts with bizarre mt dew frosting on them, washed them down with several Corona's. I figured, "what's the harm at this point?"

Got to the window. No Dice.

I had been looking for a reason to swear off Taco Bell for good. That was the push I needed.

But obviously it's not just a TB issue. And businesses do have a right to refuse service to anyone. However, they don't have the right to refuse service to an individual, based on a persons membership to a group.


We're not going to serve Bikers.

We're not going to serve Mormons.

We're not going to serve Motorcycles.

We're not going to serve brown people.

See how ridiculous it sounds?

Any 'safety of employees' issues is profiling. Any 'liability' excuse is just a lie.

jr98664
11-28-2008, 11:13 PM
…But obviously it's not just a TB issue. And businesses do have a right to refuse service to anyone. However, they don't have the right to refuse service to an individual, based on a persons membership to a group.…Any 'safety of employees' issues is profiling. Any 'liability' excuse is just a lie.

So what can we, as cyclists, do about it? What would a lawyer say?

wyeast
12-02-2008, 08:04 AM
Typically it's not about "cyclists", but rather "human-powered vehicles". It's meant mainly to keep pedestrians, skateboarders, etc from either jumping line or getting run down by the car behind them. Bikes and scooters get caught in the crossfire.

I wonder if a stoked xtra counts? ;)

Chilly Willy
12-03-2008, 02:44 AM
The real reason they don't want pedestrians and bicyclists in drive-in lanes is because there's a perception that it's too easy for them to grab the till and take off.


It has nothing to do with lawsuits or injuries.

Bjorn
12-05-2008, 03:50 PM
All their worst fears have been realized:
http://www.oregonlive.com/news/index.ssf/2008/12/bank_robber_on_bike_rolls_off.html

Seriously though I don't see how a policy that says they won't serve customers on bikes prevents crazy mofo's from rolling up with a bomb and robbing the place...


Bjorn